Lemmy.ml is somewhat more neutral. In Lemmygrad you can sometimes have a discussion, but you will probably be downvoted. Hexbear is just toxic, it’s like Lemmygrad but for 14 year olds.
I can tell you Lemmygrad and Lemmy.ml are not the same.
If anything, lemmy.ml is privacy/tech based more than anything, with disdain for capitalism.
They’re not hardcore “AYE, COMRADE” like hexbear or lemmygrad, Jesus christ
NO??? ml was the first general purpose instance and so had the most amount of users at the beginning, meaning a lot of normal communities developed there
There are communities around Lemmy dedicated to “just making lists” of leftists who also consider a middle school anarchist using an emote of Stalin as supporting genocide.
As far as I have been able to discern: a lot of reddit transplants got called nazis by established lemmy communities, so there’s kind of this whole weird internal Lemmy movement to try define ‘tankie’ as widely and negatively as ‘nazi’.
I mean, you’d think OP would know what instances they would want to block from, you know, using Lemmy. They seem to know what is ‘cringe’, but want or need that anti-leftist qualifier for good measure.
They definitely see it as an insult. Check the comment history and you’ll see there is no attempt at irony. Just an angry poster who’s fallen too deep into it.
If you go to very leftist areas of the internet (socialist or communist areas, anywhere from anarchistic (bottom left) to authoritarian (top left)) you’ll see people using liberalism by its political science definition, rather than the definition its taken on within American culture. It stems from the idea of capital moving freely (that is, liberally) without restrictions. You’ll also see it referred to as neoliberalism in the same spaces.
Full disclosure, I myself am pretty extremely socially libertarian (arguably borderline anarchistic), and have used liberal derogatively myself.
Gonna have to be that guy again, but underage cartoon porn is not CSAM. CSAM as a term was invented to help law enforcement focus their limited resources on actual child victims. Underage cartoons are still child pornography, and still wrong and illegal, but CSAM is something else and deserves more immediate action.
There’s no point in having technical terminology if it isn’t used correctly :o)
I don’t visit ani.social, a quick glimpse just now shows me a few Images that seem like borderline, but not straight-up “drawn sexualized child characters”. No idea how they usually are.
But from following the story, it seems pretty typical that even the lemmy.ml admins - who develop Lemmy as a whole - would do a defederation without a public transparent process or even a notification to the deferated instance. That’s straight up unpolite.
Lemmy.ml is run and was started by the developers of Lemmy. The developers themselves align with lemmygrad, however they try to keep their politics out of lemmy.ml for the most part. It’s debateable how effective they are with this, it probably ebbs and flows somewhat.
Moderation without informing you is common across all lemmy instances. Moderators have to go out of their way to notify you, there are no automated messages to go along with moderator action. However, lemmy has always had an open modlog, so you can see why you were moderated if you look it up. Note: sometimes I’ve had difficulty loading the modlog, particularly the instance modlog (where an overall instance ban would be), though community modlogs tend to load fine.
Also, you should bear in mind the difference between instance admin and community moderators - a community moderator is allowed to run their community as they see fit, within the rules of the instance (like reddit was supposed to be). If a moderator wants to ban you, they may have every right to per the instance rules, even if they have no good justification or you didn’t break any rules.
Certainly, the hexbear admin are just as bad as the hexbear moderators, and will throw bans around for dubious reasons while protecting their own committing the same offence. Lemmygrad moderators seem a little less eager to ban, but they’re still looking for any excuse. I haven’t had any encounters with lemmy.ml moderation though, but I wouldn’t consider the place a dumpster fire - that title firmly belongs to hexbear.
One good reason to keep lemmy.ml is simply to keep up with lemmy back-end development.
the modlogs are public, anyone can just go on hexbear, plug in your name and see why you got banned:
here’s one of your removed comments:
mod
Removed Comment Actually Palestinians started the violence. They fought a war, they lost. That doesn’t excuse anything Israel has done, but credit where credit is due. Hamas are not freedom fighters, that isn’t their goal. Their goal is to eradicate anyone that doesn’t share their beliefs. Freedom for the people of Palestine and peace in the region, but the likes of Hamas and Netanyahu can suck a bag of each others’ virgin dicks. by
TWeaK@lemm.ee
the reason you were site banned was because you were having a meltdown over getting a comm ban for your genocide apologia (lmao)
mod
Banned
TWeaK@lemm.ee
reason: convicted on purgery (malding over a comm ban :farquaad-point:)
Yes, that was shitty of me. It was a sarcastic comment against someone else (hence the :P), who also had their comments removed because they were behaving worse. But on Uplifting News, my comment really wasn’t appropriate regardless. I deserved to have those comments removed as well as the brief temporary ban there. That was good moderation.
However that has nothing to do with hexbear or anything we’re talking about here.
Focusing specifically on the comment I had removed from hexbear (quoted above), and the message I sent which led to the site ban (you can find that on Chapo from around that time), how was I being an asshole? How was my comment “genocide apologia” and how was I “malding” in the message?
I don’t think you can actually back that up with any sound reasoning. Hence, the moderators at hexbear are shit, which makes the place a dumster fire.
Lol you think I hadn’t already checked that during this discussion? I don’t need to go to hexbear to see it, lemm.ee is still federated so it shows up in my local modlog. What’s weird is that my ban on lemmy.ml doesn’t for some reason, it looks like a bug where it didn’t federate through properly - the comments shown as removed on the lemmy.ml modlog are still there on lemm.ee.
here’s one of your removed comments:
mod Removed Comment Actually Palestinians started the violence. They fought a war, they lost. That doesn’t excuse anything Israel has done, but credit where credit is due. Hamas are not freedom fighters, that isn’t their goal. Their goal is to eradicate anyone that doesn’t share their beliefs. Freedom for the people of Palestine and peace in the region, but the likes of Hamas and Netanyahu can suck a bag of each others’ virgin dicks. by TWeaK@lemm.ee
So what exactly in that is genocide apologia? Just because I’m criticising Palestinian attacks gone past does not mean I support Israel’s response in any way. The comment literally finishes with me criticising both sides - ie, implying that all genocide is wrong.
the reason you were site banned was because you were having a meltdown over getting a comm ban for your genocide apologia (lmao)
It wasn’t a meltdown, the message I sent was very tame - sarcastically thanking him for getting me banned. Feel free to dig it up, it was posted on Chapo. You’d struggle to call it “malding” - but then, that’s what you’re all about isn’t it? Slapping a bullshit label that really doesn’t fit, then arguing against that label. It’s a form of scarecrow argument, one that is completely transparent when you actually look at it.
I didn’t “both side” the genocide - that would be saying that both sides are justified in committing genocide. I’m saying anyone who commits genocide is wrong. Meanwhile, there are a bunch of people caught up in the middle of it all. You would apparently dehumanise one portion of these people, because you value the other portion more. That is reprehensible.
In any case, we’re not talking about my justification, we’re talking about hexbear moderators’ justification - of which there apparently is none. Thus, my point stands: hexbear is a dumpster fire; and that implies that hexbear devotees are trashy.
And attempt to engage in secondary unused communities? A lot of the most active communities are on it, you are just asking for your home page to be either way too filtered or a wasteland.
I’m sorry, I’m confused. You said Lemmy.ml is run by the same people as Lemmygrad.ml but if you click either of those links, you can see the admin list. Not one user is the same. Do they have different accounts, or what? Do you have some kind of citation for this?
Yes indeed but despite their more extreme beliefs compared to the average lemmings, they are quite lenient and accepting with lemmy.ml. I wouldn’t call the devs insane, solely for the fact that they gladly welcomed all the Reddit immigrants despite that they get numerous hate posts about their ideology.
Just to clarify, I’m just a normal libcenter guy, not an extremist.
But most of the moderation is done by community moderators, not admin. So it isn’t necessarily the face of the instance but the face of each individual community.
However, if the moderator doesn’t assign their username to the moderation action, then you can’t really tell who’s done it. It just says “mod”, but it could be a community moderator, or it could be an admin. I can understand a mod not wanting to publish their username with the action, but it should still at least tell you what capacity they were acting under. Generally, I think instance admin are more sensible (with the exception of hexbear).
Also, when you load the instance modlog you’ll end up seeing moderation from every other instance, and it doesn’t even tell you which community it refers to most of the time.
Lemmy.ml is run by the developers of Lemmy. They align with lemmygrad, however they try to keep their politics out of lemmy.ml. How successful they are with that is another matter.
As of a few months ago, lemmygrad is run by them as well. I don’t remember the specifics, but there was talk of some form of taking over every other Lemmy instance as well (I know there were calls for it from at least one of the tankie communities, either lemmygrad or hexbear), and the general hostility of both lemmygrad and hexbear users was why many instances defederated from them at that time.
Lemmy.ml has several solid communities, including the largest AskLemmy community. Their top 20 largest communities are all pretty mainstream and don’t really see the kind of posts/comments that make people wary of Lemmygrad or Hexbear.
I’ve had multiple bans from Lemmy.ml, they are anything but neutral. The best way to cop a ban is to make a comment arguing with their point of view that people actually agree with, they hate that.
They’re also some of the most insufferable people on the Internet.
Edit: Actually maybe it was for the whole instance lol, not sure, I hadn’t noticed I was banned for 2 weeks anyway.
Edit2: Seems it was just the one community, I was commenting on other lemmy.ml communities just fine. However the modlog doesn’t say which community I was banned from. Generally, the modlog should contain more information.
Looks like you have a year ban at POLICE PROBLEM then a 5 day instance ban on another account. Although, I’m not sure it is an instance ban, I had a similar one that had no community in the modlog but I was still able to comment on other lemmy.ml communities (this could have been a federation bug).
Multiple accounts have had a bunch of removed comments under “Rule 1” and “Rule 2” bans (which are kind of bullshit as they don’t actually reference which set of rules, the modlog doesn’t say which community it was removed from and also most rules are just bullet points and not numbered). Typically these are either bigotry or “Be civil/respsectful”, which way around they are depends on which set of rules. The former is often misused all over lemmy, but the latter can cover any hostile comment.
Currently you have a ~2 month long ban from .ml’s World News, but that does seem to me a problem community from what I’ve been seeing.
I can just imagine the look on the mod’s face when they realised their reason would be published to the modlog, trying to go back and change it only for it all to be set in stone. What’s interesting is they didn’t remove any comments.
Same, its just garbage and a shit load of snowflakes that break with the smallest difference in opinion or jokes that don’t fit with their political opinion.
It’s not, but even if it was that would mean 2/3ds of lemmy is full of licking authoritarian boots and genocide denial, so I’m fine with not seeing that.
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Lemmy.ml is somewhat more neutral. In Lemmygrad you can sometimes have a discussion, but you will probably be downvoted. Hexbear is just toxic, it’s like Lemmygrad but for 14 year olds.
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I can tell you Lemmygrad and Lemmy.ml are not the same. If anything, lemmy.ml is privacy/tech based more than anything, with disdain for capitalism. They’re not hardcore “AYE, COMRADE” like hexbear or lemmygrad, Jesus christ
Theyre run and populated by the exact same people, bud
They are a little bit more mask on than mask off, but they are just as hardcore tankie because its literally the same people
NO??? ml was the first general purpose instance and so had the most amount of users at the beginning, meaning a lot of normal communities developed there
Don’t confuse the newbie who just got out of his Reddit bubble, he’s scared and alone
Right, keep pretending the admins arent the same. Blame reddit for your confusion over 2 servers being owned by the same people.
Surely you will look clever, and smart. No one will find you out
I don’t think they’re arguing that?
Oh good! Let’s trot out the condescension!
Your sense of entitled elitism does not redound to the quality of your character.
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“Newbie” is name calling???
there’s a lot of paranoia about some of the least threatening people I’ve ever encountered
There are communities around Lemmy dedicated to “just making lists” of leftists who also consider a middle school anarchist using an emote of Stalin as supporting genocide.
As far as I have been able to discern: a lot of reddit transplants got called nazis by established lemmy communities, so there’s kind of this whole weird internal Lemmy movement to try define ‘tankie’ as widely and negatively as ‘nazi’.
I mean, you’d think OP would know what instances they would want to block from, you know, using Lemmy. They seem to know what is ‘cringe’, but want or need that anti-leftist qualifier for good measure.
Okay, liberal.
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Genuine question, is that like supposed to be a legit insult or more ironic?
They definitely see it as an insult. Check the comment history and you’ll see there is no attempt at irony. Just an angry poster who’s fallen too deep into it.
If you go to very leftist areas of the internet (socialist or communist areas, anywhere from anarchistic (bottom left) to authoritarian (top left)) you’ll see people using liberalism by its political science definition, rather than the definition its taken on within American culture. It stems from the idea of capital moving freely (that is, liberally) without restrictions. You’ll also see it referred to as neoliberalism in the same spaces.
Full disclosure, I myself am pretty extremely socially libertarian (arguably borderline anarchistic), and have used liberal derogatively myself.
wdym by
wasn’t ml started by Dessalines/nutomic??
THAT makes sense why ani.social defederated from Lemmy.ml (I only subscribed to the anime instance since it had the largest user base)
Edit: the “.ml” anime instance is still the largest compared to everyone else. What a shame that we can’t move away from it
This was Ani’s side of the story: https://ani.social/comment/2199318
Lemmy.ml defederated from ani.social, pretty sure cuz the borderline pedo bait
Yep. Explicitly because of CSAM
Gonna have to be that guy again, but underage cartoon porn is not CSAM. CSAM as a term was invented to help law enforcement focus their limited resources on actual child victims. Underage cartoons are still child pornography, and still wrong and illegal, but CSAM is something else and deserves more immediate action.
There’s no point in having technical terminology if it isn’t used correctly :o)
Good point. Lemmy.ml admins said CSAM was the reason so just passing that along.
I don’t visit ani.social, a quick glimpse just now shows me a few Images that seem like borderline, but not straight-up “drawn sexualized child characters”. No idea how they usually are.
But from following the story, it seems pretty typical that even the lemmy.ml admins - who develop Lemmy as a whole - would do a defederation without a public transparent process or even a notification to the deferated instance. That’s straight up unpolite.
Lemmy.ml is run and was started by the developers of Lemmy. The developers themselves align with lemmygrad, however they try to keep their politics out of lemmy.ml for the most part. It’s debateable how effective they are with this, it probably ebbs and flows somewhat.
Moderation without informing you is common across all lemmy instances. Moderators have to go out of their way to notify you, there are no automated messages to go along with moderator action. However, lemmy has always had an open modlog, so you can see why you were moderated if you look it up. Note: sometimes I’ve had difficulty loading the modlog, particularly the instance modlog (where an overall instance ban would be), though community modlogs tend to load fine.
Also, you should bear in mind the difference between instance admin and community moderators - a community moderator is allowed to run their community as they see fit, within the rules of the instance (like reddit was supposed to be). If a moderator wants to ban you, they may have every right to per the instance rules, even if they have no good justification or you didn’t break any rules.
Certainly, the hexbear admin are just as bad as the hexbear moderators, and will throw bans around for dubious reasons while protecting their own committing the same offence. Lemmygrad moderators seem a little less eager to ban, but they’re still looking for any excuse. I haven’t had any encounters with lemmy.ml moderation though, but I wouldn’t consider the place a dumpster fire - that title firmly belongs to hexbear.
One good reason to keep lemmy.ml is simply to keep up with lemmy back-end development.
the modlogs are public, anyone can just go on hexbear, plug in your name and see why you got banned:
here’s one of your removed comments:
the reason you were site banned was because you were having a meltdown over getting a comm ban for your genocide apologia (lmao)
People finding out that their history of being an asshole is public information will never not be funny
Be specific, which part of that was me being an asshole?
This, nonchalantly being a prick
Yes, that was shitty of me. It was a sarcastic comment against someone else (hence the :P), who also had their comments removed because they were behaving worse. But on Uplifting News, my comment really wasn’t appropriate regardless. I deserved to have those comments removed as well as the brief temporary ban there. That was good moderation.
However that has nothing to do with hexbear or anything we’re talking about here.
Focusing specifically on the comment I had removed from hexbear (quoted above), and the message I sent which led to the site ban (you can find that on Chapo from around that time), how was I being an asshole? How was my comment “genocide apologia” and how was I “malding” in the message?
I don’t think you can actually back that up with any sound reasoning. Hence, the moderators at hexbear are shit, which makes the place a dumster fire.
Lol you think I hadn’t already checked that during this discussion? I don’t need to go to hexbear to see it, lemm.ee is still federated so it shows up in my local modlog. What’s weird is that my ban on lemmy.ml doesn’t for some reason, it looks like a bug where it didn’t federate through properly - the comments shown as removed on the lemmy.ml modlog are still there on lemm.ee.
So what exactly in that is genocide apologia? Just because I’m criticising Palestinian attacks gone past does not mean I support Israel’s response in any way. The comment literally finishes with me criticising both sides - ie, implying that all genocide is wrong.
It wasn’t a meltdown, the message I sent was very tame - sarcastically thanking him for getting me banned. Feel free to dig it up, it was posted on Chapo. You’d struggle to call it “malding” - but then, that’s what you’re all about isn’t it? Slapping a bullshit label that really doesn’t fit, then arguing against that label. It’s a form of scarecrow argument, one that is completely transparent when you actually look at it.
I don’t care about your justification for both siding an ongoing genocide
I didn’t “both side” the genocide - that would be saying that both sides are justified in committing genocide. I’m saying anyone who commits genocide is wrong. Meanwhile, there are a bunch of people caught up in the middle of it all. You would apparently dehumanise one portion of these people, because you value the other portion more. That is reprehensible.
In any case, we’re not talking about my justification, we’re talking about hexbear moderators’ justification - of which there apparently is none. Thus, my point stands: hexbear is a dumpster fire; and that implies that hexbear devotees are trashy.
There is an active genocide happening, and you are going “all lives matter” because the brown people are being violent and resisting.
And attempt to engage in secondary unused communities? A lot of the most active communities are on it, you are just asking for your home page to be either way too filtered or a wasteland.
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I don’t think !pokemon@lemmy.ml is that toxic, or !linux_gaming@lemmy.ml, or !patientgamers@lemmy.ml
I always have my home to “Subscribed”, I see nothing really bothering me
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!patientgamers@sh.itjust.works is just as active
then subbing to ml as well will give you twice the activity
No, you just see everything twice.
I’m sorry, I’m confused. You said Lemmy.ml is run by the same people as Lemmygrad.ml but if you click either of those links, you can see the admin list. Not one user is the same. Do they have different accounts, or what? Do you have some kind of citation for this?
“ml” in both of these cases is supposed to mean “marxist-leninist”, always has been.
the difference is lemmy.ml is not a politics-focused instance
Lemmygrad and Lemmyml are run by the same insane people…
Yes indeed but despite their more extreme beliefs compared to the average lemmings, they are quite lenient and accepting with lemmy.ml. I wouldn’t call the devs insane, solely for the fact that they gladly welcomed all the Reddit immigrants despite that they get numerous hate posts about their ideology.
Just to clarify, I’m just a normal libcenter guy, not an extremist.
My multiple bans would suggest otherwise, you either get downvoted or banned. They really don’t like it when people actually agree with you.
That wouldn’t have anything to do with you being an obnoxious dink, would it?
Can you tell me an example? I find no reason hating someone if they agree with you.
I mean, if you make a comment arguing against their weird commie POV and it actually gets traction, they don’t like it one bit.
Huh, didn’t know that. Lemmyml seemed totally fine though?
If you want to see the face of a instance, look in the modlog.
But most of the moderation is done by community moderators, not admin. So it isn’t necessarily the face of the instance but the face of each individual community.
However, if the moderator doesn’t assign their username to the moderation action, then you can’t really tell who’s done it. It just says “mod”, but it could be a community moderator, or it could be an admin. I can understand a mod not wanting to publish their username with the action, but it should still at least tell you what capacity they were acting under. Generally, I think instance admin are more sensible (with the exception of hexbear).
Also, when you load the instance modlog you’ll end up seeing moderation from every other instance, and it doesn’t even tell you which community it refers to most of the time.
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Lemmy.ml is run by the developers of Lemmy. They align with lemmygrad, however they try to keep their politics out of lemmy.ml. How successful they are with that is another matter.
Well, I’ve never come across anything that made me notice, which is certainly a good thing.
As of a few months ago, lemmygrad is run by them as well. I don’t remember the specifics, but there was talk of some form of taking over every other Lemmy instance as well (I know there were calls for it from at least one of the tankie communities, either lemmygrad or hexbear), and the general hostility of both lemmygrad and hexbear users was why many instances defederated from them at that time.
They’re all radioactive shitholes. There is no “lesser evil”, it’s all hypocrisy and willful ignorance in those circles.
Lemmy.ml has several solid communities, including the largest AskLemmy community. Their top 20 largest communities are all pretty mainstream and don’t really see the kind of posts/comments that make people wary of Lemmygrad or Hexbear.
I’ve had multiple bans from Lemmy.ml, they are anything but neutral. The best way to cop a ban is to make a comment arguing with their point of view that people actually agree with, they hate that.
They’re also some of the most insufferable people on the Internet.
Were they bans from lemmy.ml, or from specific communities within lemmy.ml? I’ve only had a ban from !worldnews@lemmy.ml
Edit: Actually maybe it was for the whole instance lol, not sure, I hadn’t noticed I was banned for 2 weeks anyway.
Edit2: Seems it was just the one community, I was commenting on other lemmy.ml communities just fine. However the modlog doesn’t say which community I was banned from. Generally, the modlog should contain more information.
I’ve had both an account suspended, and a ban from presumably the whole instance. I didn’t care enough to investigate further.
Looks like you have a year ban at POLICE PROBLEM then a 5 day instance ban on another account. Although, I’m not sure it is an instance ban, I had a similar one that had no community in the modlog but I was still able to comment on other lemmy.ml communities (this could have been a federation bug).
Multiple accounts have had a bunch of removed comments under “Rule 1” and “Rule 2” bans (which are kind of bullshit as they don’t actually reference which set of rules, the modlog doesn’t say which community it was removed from and also most rules are just bullet points and not numbered). Typically these are either bigotry or “Be civil/respsectful”, which way around they are depends on which set of rules. The former is often misused all over lemmy, but the latter can cover any hostile comment.
Currently you have a ~2 month long ban from .ml’s World News, but that does seem to me a problem community from what I’ve been seeing.
This one was funny:
I can just imagine the look on the mod’s face when they realised their reason would be published to the modlog, trying to go back and change it only for it all to be set in stone. What’s interesting is they didn’t remove any comments.
That is actually quite funny. I should go and wind up Lemmygrad then, I thought I was banned from the instance.
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Not even remotely close to 2/3, and it’s the whiney and annoying chunk anyway. I don’t want to “not engage”, I want them out of my feed.
Same, its just garbage and a shit load of snowflakes that break with the smallest difference in opinion or jokes that don’t fit with their political opinion.
seconded. lemmy.ml has afaik the biggest interesing communities for FOSS, privacy, Memes, etc.
Aka whining about YouTube ads, paranoia, and communist whingeing thinly veiled as humour.
No big loss.
You could have stayed on reddit, but here we are.
Lol they always out themselves
Seems like you outted yourself as cringe.
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Jesse what the fuck are you talking about dot jpeg
You really love the bomb, do you?
It’s not, but even if it was that would mean 2/3ds of lemmy is full of licking authoritarian boots and genocide denial, so I’m fine with not seeing that.
Add ani.social too IMO.