I’m an advocate of moving towards anarchism. So actions that facilitate that shift, which ironically can include voting when applicable along the path.
I’m anti fascist. Voting is the only non-violent way to remove them from power. If you’re not doing everything you can to do so, you might be a tanky or fascist.
Voting is not the only way and not the only non-violent way. Mass strikes, shutdown of the state economy and mass non compliance also work. This requires class solidarity tho, which we will need to reach.
Voting is probably the easiest way, which in this environment, seems pretty fucking hard. It still doesn’t address the cause of all our anger. That is, our quality of life and rights being stolen.
The easiest way to do what? Remove fascism? How is that working out in the US? Surely the point can’t be to “just endure fascism for four years and then surely the fascist will give us opportunity to remove him from power by voting”?
Fascism as an ideology can’t be voted out. I’m saying, in an unrigged and fair election, you have the opportunity to try and vote out a fascist. Unless you think not trying and not voting is a better option. I’m not saying voting is the answer, rather, a very small part of actions we should be doing. Fascism ends in death camps and wars, not working class revolution.
People showed up in 2020. A lot of them didn’t show up to vote because the dems ran on “fund the police!”. Some did because low information or lesser evil or w/e, but far fewer than if the dems didn’t tell them to go fuck themselves.
We are both opposed to fascism. I would say you have a pacifist position. I’m not a pacifist and am unfamiliar with non-violent solutions to tankies or fascists. Are there examples of removing tankies or fascists without violence?
The only violence when the USSR dissolved was by liberals shooting the congress building with a tank, and if you consider the conditions associated with a greater drop in life expectancy than any non-war or genocide in the 20th century to be a form of violence. The only violence when Allande was overthrown was by liberals, and same with Jakarta.
Turns out if you don’t use violence to defend the revolution, really bad things happen, from the immiseration of the entire population to murdering anyone left of mussulini. If you do, then liberals on the internet call you authoritarian.
Voting doesn’t remove fascists from power when the only winners allowed are fascists since people refuse to actually support the non-fascist options cause “they’re not viable”.
It most certainly would if the spirit to resist and protect our rights and freedoms overcome the oppression. Don’t give up. Neoliberalism needs to be fought tooth and nail but a Democrat won’t advocate for your death for your dissent.
Except they do. Dems have been telling leftists to get fucked for decades and some decide to bow to them in hopes they can maybe one day have an imaginary crumb. Those people are the ones keeping things from getting better when everyone needs to unite and literally fight against capitalist parties and their supporters instead of figuratively and performatively fighting them.
If you want to go to war with this fascist government with half the population supporting it. Go right ahead. It’s not going to end well. Trump is doing a great job at destroying the country and it’s going to come to a point where everyone is on the same page. That’s when action makes sense. In the meantime I’m going to my best to put the spanner in the works.
The country being destroyed started LONG before Trump. He’s just a convenient scapegoat for do-nothing libs to point at this time like Manchin and Sinema were last time.
I’m an advocate of moving towards anarchism. So actions that facilitate that shift, which ironically can include voting when applicable along the path.
I’m anti fascist. Voting is the only non-violent way to remove them from power. If you’re not doing everything you can to do so, you might be a tanky or fascist.
Voting is not the only way and not the only non-violent way. Mass strikes, shutdown of the state economy and mass non compliance also work. This requires class solidarity tho, which we will need to reach.
Voting is probably the easiest way, which in this environment, seems pretty fucking hard. It still doesn’t address the cause of all our anger. That is, our quality of life and rights being stolen.
The easiest way to do what? Remove fascism? How is that working out in the US? Surely the point can’t be to “just endure fascism for four years and then surely the fascist will give us opportunity to remove him from power by voting”?
Fascism as an ideology can’t be voted out. I’m saying, in an unrigged and fair election, you have the opportunity to try and vote out a fascist. Unless you think not trying and not voting is a better option. I’m not saying voting is the answer, rather, a very small part of actions we should be doing. Fascism ends in death camps and wars, not working class revolution.
I question if someone this unwilling in voting would even show up to something violent that takes way more efforts.
People showed up in 2020. A lot of them didn’t show up to vote because the dems ran on “fund the police!”. Some did because low information or lesser evil or w/e, but far fewer than if the dems didn’t tell them to go fuck themselves.
We are both opposed to fascism. I would say you have a pacifist position. I’m not a pacifist and am unfamiliar with non-violent solutions to tankies or fascists. Are there examples of removing tankies or fascists without violence?
The only violence when the USSR dissolved was by liberals shooting the congress building with a tank, and if you consider the conditions associated with a greater drop in life expectancy than any non-war or genocide in the 20th century to be a form of violence. The only violence when Allande was overthrown was by liberals, and same with Jakarta.
Turns out if you don’t use violence to defend the revolution, really bad things happen, from the immiseration of the entire population to murdering anyone left of mussulini. If you do, then liberals on the internet call you authoritarian.
If you vote out a fascist from an office, is that not removal. If you’re talking about removing ideology, violence won’t help at all.
Voting doesn’t remove fascists from power when the only winners allowed are fascists since people refuse to actually support the non-fascist options cause “they’re not viable”.
It most certainly would if the spirit to resist and protect our rights and freedoms overcome the oppression. Don’t give up. Neoliberalism needs to be fought tooth and nail but a Democrat won’t advocate for your death for your dissent.
Except they do. Dems have been telling leftists to get fucked for decades and some decide to bow to them in hopes they can maybe one day have an imaginary crumb. Those people are the ones keeping things from getting better when everyone needs to unite and literally fight against capitalist parties and their supporters instead of figuratively and performatively fighting them.
If you want to go to war with this fascist government with half the population supporting it. Go right ahead. It’s not going to end well. Trump is doing a great job at destroying the country and it’s going to come to a point where everyone is on the same page. That’s when action makes sense. In the meantime I’m going to my best to put the spanner in the works.
The country being destroyed started LONG before Trump. He’s just a convenient scapegoat for do-nothing libs to point at this time like Manchin and Sinema were last time.