- cross-posted to:
- linux_memes@programming.dev
- cross-posted to:
- linux_memes@programming.dev
Cross-posted from “It’s that time again” by @Atherel@lemmy.dbzer0.com in !linux_memes@programming.dev
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The other week had a GNOME dev reply to a thread of mine on mastodon stating that the users desire to select a default terminal emulator was an “edge case” and it was beneath GNOME. then all the GNOME fanboys came out to his defense.
It’s an insufferable DE and community.
As insufferable as KDE users always shitting on gnome?
I’ve generally found gnome users just use it. New KDE releases don’t have gnome fanboys bashing it, etc.
But new GNOME releases? Directly the opposite.
Really wish people would just chill.
Yeah, there is way less hate and mockery towards KDE. Now let’s think why that might be
To me it speaks more of the users, less of the DE.
Either somehow every GNOME user is a saint and everyone else is just an asshole, or GNOME is laughably bad and every new release is also bad. It’s either of those two.
I’ve generally found gnome users just use it
lol
As insufferable as KDE users always shitting on gnome?
This 100%
New KDE releases don’t have gnome fanboys bashing it
There is a lot less hate for KDE… Because KDE doesn’t break the user experience every time it updates. Gnome is the Apple of the Linux world. The entire dev team embodies the Apple attitude of “we know better than you, and you’re wrong for wanting to use anything except the default settings.”
You’re essentially getting the “iPhone user seeing all of the hate from android users every time iOS updates” experience. Because every time a new iPhone feature comes out, all of the android users go “lmao iOS didn’t have that feature until now? Android had it three years ago. Apple fucking sucks.”
I find that Penis Stroker 2000 never has users bashing it when a new release comes out.
But every single new release of Scrotum Puncher 5000 that comes out, it’s getting criticized. I’m sick of it!!
At least for a time, many of the big distributions focused exclusively on Gnome, and for KDE users it was kind of frustrating as everything would be all wired up for Gnome, and either KDE wasn’t packaged at all and you had to go third party, or it was a clearly second class citizen where the packagers just didn’t bother to wire up equivalent features. You would look it up and see how KDE had the same capability implemented, but the packager just hadn’t included some dependency or configured something to manifest it.
Now I feel like the distributions take Plasma more seriously and so it’s easier to just ignore whatever Gnome is doing… Except for the occasional horrible UI presented by a Gnome app in your otherwise credible desktop. Since Gnome is both a DE and a UI framework, the UI framework gets to rear its head even if you largely ignore the DE.
Then of course you have the tiling window managers/compositors, but those projects tend to be less ambitious anyway, and what the audience wants is pretty much what they can get from packages, even if the packagers aren’t quite as invested to know what can be done.
Such a GNOME thing to say
I checked your Mastodon timeline but I don’t see the post, only the one where you relate the story.
I deleted it because the GNOME users were getting annoying.
I don’t use gnome because I don’t think a desktop use interface should be designed for iPads
I’ve got Gnome installed on a tablet PC. It’s not good there, either.
When I first used Linux I loved Gnome for the intuitiveness and simplicity but I did not like the same thing you were saying. I guess it makes a good desktop for tablets lol.
The thing is in theory I love gnome for that. In practice keep that shit away from me
This is why I stopped using Gnome. After every update most of my extensions stopped working. Some took ages to get up to date or were abandoned. And there was no simple way to enable all extensions that the update disabled, having to manually enable them one by one. Maybe that has changed now? It’s been yearsnow… Not that I would go back anyway, tiling managers is where it’s at.
GNOME is great but people recommending it to beginners need to make it clear that there is only minor customization, and that major customization / extensions will cause headaches.
Plasma is highly customizable out of the box. It’s personal preference in the end of course.
Then, after that, you can introduce them to Hyprland which is EVEN MORE customizable, at the cost of learning the hyprlang and jsonc if you also want waybar.
And then there is sway. Which makes you cry but respected.
Isn’t sway more limited in customization compared to hyprland?
(i know that swayfx is for that, but still not sure if it’a as good)
Yeah, probably true. It was a lighthearted joke, I do not know too much about sway or hyperland.
We all got choices, that’s what I like about Linux. KDE seems to run great for most people, for me it always seems to bug out and act super janky (the panel editor in particular would bug out and crash constantly, I could never get the damn thing to where I liked it). If it was more stable for me I’d probably use it, I love customizing my system. I’ve tried making it work a few times, never seems to click.
GNOME’s extensions may break on updates from time to time but my day to day experience with it is much nicer. While more rigid it’s a lot more polished and doesn’t crash out on me just using the interface. I like the layout of it. I’m glad KDE works for so many of you guys, but I’ll stick with GNOME until a better option comes around.
That said, if anyone has a better suggestion for a desktop environment I’m all ears.
I just don’t customise very much, either DE mentioned. I did initially when I was new to using Linux out of novelty, but I noticed stuff breaks the more I deviated from the norm after enough updates. Plus it’s such a timesink to begin with. I realised I just wanted to use the fucking computer, not tinker and fight it.
KDE on my office desktop. I like one of the themes CachyOS ships with so I left it at that.
GNOME on the living room PC hooked up to a TV. I think it works better there controlled by a wireless trackpad keyboard from the couch and for purely entertainment purposes. Stremio, web browsing, and gaming.
When’s the last time you tried Plasma? I felt the same way about it as you did until version 6. I’ve been driving it now since 6.2 and its at least as polished as Gnome but with WAY more features and almost infinite customization out of the box.
I tried version 6 last, the customization kept crashing the desktop, it didn’t like me messing with the panels at all. I just wanted a top bar and a dock.
I’ve recently installed the latest version for my fiance who is transitioning from Windows. Immediately there was a small problem with the app menu leaving graphical artifacts on the panel when the menu got closed (it was fixed by increasing the animation speed a bunch somehow?).
After a certain point I gave up and moved on, I can’t agree that it’s as polished as Gnome from my personal experience with the two. But as always, user experience may vary. My experience with KDE seems to be a minority which is good for everyone else lol
Hmm, well, “works on my computer” is never a helpful comment but I have a heavily modified panel that I moved to the top with no issues.
I’m using the built-in task manager widget rather than a dock. Maybe that’s why?
Mind me asking what distro? And Wayland or X11? Also, which dock?
I’m using Wayland and Fedora (Plasma 6.4) and also had a good experience with NixOS (6.3, also Wayland).
I’ve been using Nobara for a long time now, before that I was on Debian, before that Kubuntu. I’ve tried both Wayland and X11 on Nobara until they fully switched to Wayland, they both had issues.
I tried several variations on getting a dock to work, but even organizing the top bar or editing any of the panels at all was causing glitches and crashes. After a certain point I said fuck it and tried Gnome, my problems went away and it only took a few extensions to get it where I wanted. Been more stable since the switch so I haven’t been inclined to go back myself.
Hmm, oh well. As long as you found your happy place…
Don’t get me wrong, I’m happy it works for you. Linux has something for everyone and that’s fantastic.
Once Gnome dispences grilled cheese sandwiches it’ll be my true happy place
Cinnamon. After using Xfce and KDE Plasma for years, and having testing Gnome, Budgie, etc., Cinnamon feels like it took the best ingredients from all of them.
I’ll try it out in a VM when I have a bit, looks like something I could recommend to Windows 10 refugees
Kinda same, but I would also always tinker with Plasma endlessly customising every little bit, installed applets and widgets to check if they’re better than what I’m currently using. It got tiresome, but I just couldn’t stop myself. After a while I installed Gnome and just embraced the simplicity.
Which is why Plasma is better
Dunno, I saw GNOME 3 run like molasses on my PC, went “ok, this might be lost cause”, went with LXDE and then XFCE, and now I’m like “if it’s a beefy proper PC I’ll go with KDEPlasma and if it’s, like, very obsolete system I’ll, dunno, go with XFCE”.
GNOME is just opinionated. I get it, it was kinda vaguely modeled after Mac OS, which is kinda an opinionated desktop environment, but the thing is, it’s even more opinionated than Mac OS ever was. The thing about (early!) Mac OS X was “hey, we have this slick desktop environment but also some power user features you might want to use. But we’re not forcing you to!” (Kinda like GNOME 2!) …GNOME has been kinda sweeping those under the rug, in my opinion.
It really is a shame that they force you to update to the new version. If only there was some way to continue using the existing Gnome version until the extensions have been updated by their authors.
If you want to update your software broadly, it’s a pain in the ass if you need to try to hold gnome and only gnome back.
And many of those extensions get abandoned after the authors get tired of the treadmill of having to redo stuff they already did.
The funniest thing about this is that, according to a Gnome dev, they decided to not create APIs or anything and keep relying on extensions to monkey-patch code into the gnome-shell process to ensure “developer freedom”.
It’s completely mad. I uninstalled Gnome after it crashed on me multiple times, taking either my work or (once) my game process with it.
On KDE at least IF the shell crashes it doesn’t cause all my programs to become unavailable too, I can save whatever I was doing. Its UI/UX is arguably a mess, but at least it god damn works reliably and doesn’t come as barren wasteland with missing base features. I would love to love Gnome, but god damn it hell no.
Shouldn’t that only apply if the other software depends on the new functionality in the updated gnome?
So if I want various things in fedora 42, but I have to refrain because my favorite extension hasn’t been ported from fedora 41. I didn’t use gnome largely because I got tired of keeping up with the extension mess.
Not all of us are trying to micromanage every little piece of software independentlly.
Pinning the version of one package doesn’t constitute “micromanage every little piece of software independentlly”.
No need to get hyperbolic.
If you’re not willing to take even a small action to customize your system, then you should just take what you get and don’t throw a fit.
Or I just pick a solution that lets me customize as I like and supports it in a way I can feel confident about taking updates without worry. So Plasma desktop it is
Gnome is not gods gift to desktop users that I feel I must accommodate, it’s a competent implementation that is just too set in their ways .
👍 I agree with that and personally use Plasma currently, though have mained gnome in the past.
Yes the volunteer software authors should work to the beat of the drum of the baying and braying users who insist on using cutting edge software before its wider ecosystem has adapted to its novelties. A very good point.
No, either gnome should actually support a lot of these things people are such with extensions for it or at least provide some semblance of compatibility if they are so insistent that extensions are the only way to get some of these customizations.
It’s just odd to simultaneously praise extensions as the way for users to get what they want while undermining them every release.
Wrong on all counts. the voluntary software authors actually go out of their way to spite users, extension developers and sysadmins by constantly trying to redefine what is a standard UX.
Just don’t upgrade to the next OS version?
I’d you are on rolling release tho, that’s on you. Rolling release is by definition the opposite of stable
Most package managers allow pinning software versions, you could look into that for your distro. Might come in handy in other use cases too.
There is literally one working todo thingy extension for GNOME. KDE has one included.
Same with Manjaro and the AUR.
So you have an example? It never happened to me the last 7 years.
Yeah I very much like dislike the culture of Gnome… maybe I’ll try something else someday. KDE isn’t for me but Cosmic maybe.
It’s your own fault you use GNOME
I’ve only ever used DEs that aren’t gnome. And that wasn’t really by choice - it was a workplace. But after hearing about how gnome treats their users… fuck that. I went so far recently as to try to make a nix system that was 100% free of gnome shit and I have actually hard a really difficult time because it has wormed its way into other dependencies.
I never had too many issues with GNOME but didn’t install loads of extensions. Looking forward to seeing Cosmic grow and develop further, took a while but finally in beta
I used to be a Gnome fan. But I hate the direction they took from Gnome shell 4 onwards. Now I use KDE and I’m happy with it.
