• @wpb@lemmy.world
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    442 days ago

    Jury nullification occurs when a jury returns a Not Guilty verdict even though jurors believe beyond reasonable doubt that the defendant has broken the law. Because the Not Guilty verdict cannot be overturned, and because the jurors cannot be punished for their verdict, the law is said to be nullified in that particular case.

  • @Furbag@lemmy.world
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    982 days ago

    Fuckin’ snitches.

    No wait, hang on, you’re telling me that this guy managed to get out of New York City after committing one of the most high profile killings ever and instead of laying low and waiting for the news to blow over he got caught in a McDonalds during an active manhunt with a fake I.D., the murder weapon, and a manifesto all on his person? Either he wanted to get caught, or I smell a scapegoat here. Can’t have America’s oldest gang losing face in front of their corporate sponsors, now can we?

  • @Noite_Etion@lemmy.world
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    1022 days ago

    Officer Tyler Frye, who has only been on the job for about six months, and a fellow officer responded to the McDonald’s where the suspect was spotted, the AP reports.

    They asked him to pull his blue medical mask down and “recognized him immediately” Frye said. “We didn’t even think twice about it, we knew that was our guy.”

    Frye said, “It feels good to get a guy like that off the street, especially starting my career this way, it feels great.”

    Yeah… Great job. I’m sure your corporate overloads will appreciate it.

  • 2 days ago the “experts” were telling us how the shooters planning and brains were why he got out of the city so easily. now we’re being told that he just happened to have the gun, silencer, fake id, and manifesto all on his person? not a chance, feel bad for this guy who’s obviously a scapegoat and just the first similar looking dude they found

  • @JovialMicrobial@lemm.ee
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    2 days ago

    We can’t let the media take the narrative back and let them do a smear campaign on this person who might not even be the shooter. He’s a suspect.

    This ceo shooting broke the proverbial spell where what the population was actually saying wasn’t being guided or swayed by the news.

    We need to keep the steam up on the media pushback. All those savage, snarky comments and memes left on every news article, fb post, tweet… they got overwhelmed by us. That needs to keep happening so they can’t go back to distracting and brainwashing people with fear and politics while they scapegoat this guy and try to make an example of him to the rest of us plebs.

    They already tried to distract us with aliens and Diddy because people won’t stop saying how much they hate insurance companies. Keep voicing your discontent where ever they leave an open comment box. Please do it. Not only is it cathartic, but it upsets the oligarchs and everytime you upset an oligarch someone’s insurance is less likely to deny their claim.

    • @Clbull@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      That $50,000 bounty is likely a bigger payout than two years of wages as a burger flipper…

      • EleventhHour
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        1742 days ago

        And this is how the elite force us “lowers” to fight against each other instead of fighting them.

        • @CeruleanRuin
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          122 days ago

          Sure, but there’s a reason that scabs used to be beaten and shunned. Solidarity means everyone, and the consequences for breaking it need to be high or it’s too easy for the bosses to pick people off one by one by offering them bonuses for ratfucking their peers.

        • LeadersAtWork
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          202 days ago

          It’s always been that way and will always be that way. The point isn’t to stop the infighting entirely, it’s to work in such ways as to reduce the impact it has on the goals we should be striving to achieve. Namely a better world for everyone.

            • LeadersAtWork
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              82 days ago

              It will always be this way because people have opinions and perspectives. The two best ways to lessen infighting is by having a simple and common end goal. The second is a leader. Find both of these and I guarantee people will follow.

      • @Etterra@lemmy.world
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        192 days ago

        It would be a shame if the person who sold out were publicly identified. Hopefully that will never ever happen.

        • @superkret@feddit.org
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          252 days ago

          Yes, in all honesty, hopefully that will never happen.
          What, are you hoping for vigilante justice against a minimum wage worker?

          • @Vespair@lemm.ee
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            22 days ago

            Did you forget that shame exists? Not all, hell not even most calls to name an offender are a call for violence, the vast majority are calls for accountability and potentially shame.

      • @NoNotLikeThat@lemm.ee
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        52 days ago

        I’m no expert, but wouldn’t the snitch have to pay taxes on the reward they receive? So they have earned the ire of a nation for a small stack of cash that they’ll likely blow within a year. Smort.

    • @Yodan@lemm.ee
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      1802 days ago

      Nothing good comes out of Altoona, look at their fucking “pizza”

      • @timestatic@feddit.org
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        -542 days ago

        Someone that has their own morals, and thinks killing is bad? Totally a bootlicker! For me its about principles. The death of this CEO changes nothing

        • @Kichae@lemmy.ca
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          332 days ago

          The principle should be “harm society at large, abandon the protections of society”.

        • @antonim@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          252 days ago

          Someone that has their own morals, and thinks killing is bad?

          Can we guarantee they’d report him if there was no financial incentive?

          The system really doesn’t give a fuck about your or anyone else’s morals, let’s not pretend otherwise. That’s why they put a bounty on the killer, after all.

        • @ayyy@sh.itjust.works
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          222 days ago

          So if killing one person is bad, isn’t killing hundreds to thousands of innocent people/year hundreds to thousands of times more bad?

          • @timestatic@feddit.org
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            21 day ago

            He isn’t except from the justice system last time I remember. He is also not personally and individual to blame for the sole responsibility of those deaths. Also a murder isn’t the same as a person dying of something else because that didn’t get treated.

            I’m not a total corpo bootlicker no worries, but I believe this is just one more death this whole system claims and I despise the celebration of his death. I believe in the end this death changes nothing, like I said

            • NoneOfUrBusiness
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              52 days ago

              It does, though. This guy was a fucking asshole even for a health insurance company CEO.

              • @Frozengyro@lemmy.world
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                32 days ago

                I mean, yes it does change things for CEO+family. But nothing is going to change regarding how these companies treat people.

                • NoneOfUrBusiness
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                  32 days ago

                  I meant in the sense that he took a, well, normal insurer and raised its claim denial rates to one of the highest in the industry. The world is legitimately a better place with him gone, because while I doubt UHC will accept more claims at least he won’t be around to kill even more people.

        • AFK BRB Chocolate
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          02 days ago

          I don’t eat at McDonald’s for a variety of reasons, but I doubt very much that the company has anything to do with the guy being called in.

          • @Sterile_Technique@lemmy.world
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            82 days ago

            Doesn’t matter. They’ve been at the forefront of bullshit lately, and their product is shit/expensive. McD’s is one of the organizations that needs to just end.

    • magnetosphere
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      342 days ago

      As much as I dislike them calling, I can’t really be mad at someone who’s making minimum or near-minimum wage for being tempted by the reward money. There’s a good chance they’re living paycheck to paycheck.

        • @Valencia@sh.itjust.works
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          2 days ago

          Have a little faith in humanity? If it’s a 19 year old working through college that’s basically their whole 4 year tuition and them some in that area

          • @NoNotLikeThat@lemm.ee
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            42 days ago

            You must not know how much tuition is. That’ll cover a year at a place like NYU. Maybe 2 years for an out-of state school.

          • @PunnyName@lemmy.world
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            52 days ago

            Didn’t say I didn’t have faith. But the likelihood they will have much in a years’ time is extremely low.

      • ERROR: Earth.exe has crashed
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        142 days ago

        Well this guy literally had all incriminating evidence on him. With that level of carelessness, he’s gonna get caught sooner or later. Like the pulling the mask down is just asking for trouble.

        Maybe he just wanted to chill a bit and see himself famous before eventually planning to let himself get caught. Who knows?

        I mean, he might just wanna let himself get caught to not have the blame pinned on a scapegoat.

        • @halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world
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          192 days ago

          Having all the incriminating evidence on him seems… Extremely unlikely considering the rest of what we know about the situation.

          That’s the type of shit you’d expect from desperate police planting evidence. Planting a random suppressor, a supposedly “phantom” 3d printed gun, and a manifesto isn’t exactly hard. Only the gun could possibly be directly traced to the bullets fired, and that’s not something they can test in the field.

          Not saying that’s necessarily the case here, but this would not be the first time law enforcement, including the FBI, planted evidence because of outside pressures.

          • ERROR: Earth.exe has crashed
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            2 days ago

            Ehh…

            I mean, there’s probably CCTV footage of him chillin’ in the McDonalds, and also the bodycam footage of the cops entering the Mcdonalds and searching him. Its not that easy to plant a bunch of evidence with all those cameras aroung, and creating a bunch of fake bodycam footage isn’t really that easy. So as long as they release those video footage, I’d believe this is the guy.

            • @Thisiswritteningerman@midwest.social
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              22 days ago

              Do they plant the evidence on him in the McDonald’s, or is it just in a bag at the station and it’s “found on him” when they search him there? Planting it publicly seems hard. Would have to give every officer a bag of “evidence” or know who was going to respond to the call. Besides the whole not getting seen planting it by the public.

              • ERROR: Earth.exe has crashed
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                22 days ago

                I think its standard operating procedure to search a suspect right after detaining to make sure he doesn’t have weapons, so I’d assume its all on the bodycam footage.

                Well, if they release bodycam footage of the arrest right at the mcdonalds and also the searched conducted in the same footage, without any cuts, then I’d believe it.

                If theres any cuts, or weird video artifacts, or if experts say the footage could be faked, then I’m gonna be very sus.

    • nifty
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      242 days ago

      Rich people are the only class with any solidarity.

    • @Yawweee877h444@lemmy.world
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      142 days ago

      It sucks major but it could be someone who lives in a small bubble, doesn’t use social media, and only watches fox news. Or whatever local news channel. If that’s all they see, they might think they did the right thing. They could be oblivious.

      They could also be a bootlicker. Time will tell if we get more info. If their info is released the 50k probably won’t be worth it.

    • @Maggoty@lemmy.world
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      92 days ago

      Idealistic teenagers will get you every time. Old enough to drink the Flavor Aid, young enough to not have the experience to temper it.

    • @CeruleanRuin
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      -12 days ago

      Who probably doesn’t even have health insurance at all. People acting against their own self-interest are all over the place.

      • @Sterile_Technique@lemmy.world
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        112 days ago

        Nuance: unjustified murder is wrong. Someone who dedicates their life to destroying others for profit, murdering them is significantly less violent than letting them persist, and is therefore justified.

        • @atzanteol@sh.itjust.works
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          02 days ago

          Nuance… There are people calling for violence against the McDonald’s employee who reported the murderer to the police.

          Tankies didn’t know the meaning of the word “nuance”. People who express nuance are “Nazi sympathizers” or “class traitors”. Anyone with a remotely “centrist” view is “sitting in a Nazi bar” and therefore culpable.

          This place is a shithole of absolute moralism.

          • @Sterile_Technique@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            The leading sentiment in this thread is that while that worker is indeed a class traitor, that their decision was at least understandable due to the financial crunch they’re likely in as a McDonald’s employee.

            YOU are exhibiting absolute moralism and an abandon of nuance by cherry picking a few extremists to represent the entire response that’s growing against the unethical direction health insurers’ have taken their industry.

            If you see a call for violence against the McD worker, report it.

            • @atzanteol@sh.itjust.works
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              22 days ago

              Cherry picking??? There are tons of examples!

              “Fuck the people who reported him.”

              “That McDonald’s worker should be hiding”

              “The employee sent someone to live life in prison. As far as drag’s concerned, that is murder.”

              Something something “nazi bar” my friend. Or in this case it’s a “tankie bar”.

              • @Sterile_Technique@lemmy.world
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                11 day ago

                “Fuck the people who reported him.”

                Yeah, fuck em. They decided to be a piece of shit. That isn’t a call to violence.

                “That McDonald’s worker should be hiding”

                Probably should be - they just pissed off nearly an entire country. That isn’t a call to violence either.

                “The employee sent someone to live life in prison. As far as drag’s concerned, that is murder.”

                While not accurate, it’s still not a call to violence.

                …maybe cherry picking isn’t what you’re doing after all - it’s sounding more like you’re just making shit up and projecting some fantasy tankie persona onto the comments you don’t agree with.

  • @shikitohno@lemm.ee
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    1512 days ago

    I’d like to send out a special “Fuck you” to the asshole that called this tip in, whether it turns out to be the real shooter or not. I can’t imagine being such a piece of trash to go do that.

  • Riskable
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    2472 days ago

    Upon further investigation, officers recovered a firearm on the man, as well as a suppressor, both consistent with the weapon used in the murder.

    Ummm… That’s awfully convenient. He just happened to have brought that exact gun with its suppressor to McDonald’s. I’m skeptical.

      • @Stovetop@lemmy.world
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        1632 days ago

        You mean that very legal and factually-suppprted facet of the American justice system that every juror should be informed about before making a decision in court?

        • EleventhHour
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          -552 days ago

          Technically, it is not legal. However, there’s no way to either prove it, nor is there any recourse against it.

          • Codex
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            632 days ago

            Please point me to the statute or code which states a juror is legally obliged to render an accurate and truthful verdict, and explain how you would enforce such a thing.

            • EleventhHour
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              2 days ago

              I guess you’ve never done jury duty, but when I have, they make you swear an oath more or less to that effect. I’m pretty sure it can be prosecuted, but if you want to the specific laws, you’re welcome to find that for yourself.

              • @3ntranced@lemmy.world
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                252 days ago

                If you have also done jury duty, you will recall that the duration of the deliberation is done in a sealed room with no officials present.

                You can absolutely conspire to nullify in complete discretion because your conversations legally cannot leave the room until the case has shut.

                • @Waraugh@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  322 days ago

                  I hung and nullified a jury myself. It was very uncomfortable. At two points I requested the judge to come in and explain to the rest of the jurors I didn’t owe them any explanation for my not guilty verdict. It took the trial out an additional two days and everyone was pissed at me but I was not going to sit in my privilege and give a guy a felony conviction after months of obvious police harassment.

          • @winterayars@sh.itjust.works
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            312 days ago

            It is actually legal. It’s built directly from the laws and kind of a necessary component if you want jury trials to actually work and not just be a kangaroo court. People just don’t like it.

          • @Tyfud@lemmy.world
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            2 days ago

            It is very much legal. It just gets used by jurors to try and get out of jury duty, and then, judges will try and hold you in contempt if you attempt to use it for that purpose.

          • @takeda@lemmy.world
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            2 days ago

            Technically we have jury exactly for that reason.

            Otherwise we only would need a judge.

            The whole idea behind jury is meant to prevent judge from convicting someone if peers don’t believe the crime should be punished.

          • @Maggoty@lemmy.world
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            22 days ago

            The hivemind didn’t like that but it’s true, in most states just uttering the words anywhere near the courthouse can cause mistrials and a misdemeanor charge.

      • plz1
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        492 days ago

        They revised mod policy to only hand out bans/deletions if jury nullification was referenced as a cause to vilence, not a reaction o past events. I’m paraphrasing, of course.

        • @cm0002@lemmy.world
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          432 days ago

          Yeah, basically

          “Go do [Violence] and we’ll do jury nullification afterwards” is bad, bur

          “[Violence happened], but it was justified in the eyes of the majority of people so jury Nullification should happen”

          Is OK

          • @CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social
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            212 days ago

            I think that message was a sort of sarcastic way of getting around a “dont talk about jury nullification” rule, in that saying “we cant talk about x”, while making it very clear what x is, prompts people unfamiliar with x to go look it up

          • Monkey With A Shell
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            62 days ago

            Because the refusal to convict someone based on laws and circumstances you feel are unjust is wrong and goes against everything the ruling class have fought for.

              • @Stovetop@lemmy.world
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                32 days ago

                The “good ol’ boy” excuse.

                • “He’s got a promising life ahead of him!”

                • “It’s just how things are done, that ain’t his fault!”

                • “He just didn’t know any better!”

                • “We’ve all done stupid things before, who are we to judge?”

                • “He’s a pillar of the community, think of all the good he’s done!”

      • @jeffw@lemmy.worldM
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        2 days ago

        To clarify, the admins have updated their views in reaction to this week and user feedback:

        Following a discussion in our team we want to clarify that we are no longer requesting moderators to remove content relating to jury nullification in the context of violent crimes when the crime in question already happened. We will still consider suggestions of jury nullification for crimes that have not (yet) happened as advocation for violence, which is violating our terms of service.

        • @Maggoty@lemmy.world
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          2 days ago

          The policy was cleared up, basically EU/Dutch/Finnish law doesn’t like Jury Nullification in regards to future crimes/calls to violence. But in regards to crimes already committed it’s fine. And being as that’s where .world is hosted, that’s the law they go by.

          • @flicker@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            42 days ago

            Switched to dbzer0 straight after seeing a mod try and justify the censorship of this topic by saying something along the lines of “only God can judge.”

            Now I get to enjoy aaaall the content world has defederated from.

    • @timestatic@feddit.org
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      2 days ago

      You really think every person in real life goes ahead with supporting this murder just because you heard enough people online repeating this in this echo chamber?

  • @RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    Catching the suspect came down to “good old-fashioned police work,” New York Mayor Eric Adams said Monday, citing the McDonald’s employee who called in a tip.

    Lol, you mean someone hitting the “easy” button and telling cops where he is? That’s “police work”? Waiting around for someone to do the work for you?

    Edit: I wouldn’t want to be the person collecting the reward for the arrest of this individual.

  • @bdonvr@thelemmy.club
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    1442 days ago

    These companies don’t care about you, or your kids, or your grandkids. They have zero qualms about burning down the planet for a buck, so why should we have any qualms about burning them down to survive?

    We’re animals just like everything else on this planet, except we’ve forgotten the law of the jungle and bend over for our overlords when any other animal would recognize the threat and fight to the death for their survival. “Violence never solved anything” is a statement uttered by cowards and predators.

    (Quote from a book review made by the suspect)

  • @Infynis@midwest.social
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    782 days ago

    He made it all the way to middle-of-nowhere PA, but he was still carrying all the evidence on him? Sounds like they found Spartacus