So I was toying around with the idea of what it would take to go full Snowdon mode. I starting looking around for info online about how to de-bank yourself and unfortunately non of what I found was useful. One comment on a related reddit post literally said you should just get over your irrational fear of banks, which I get what he means from a great depression standpoint but that’s still incredibly unhelpful. Other resources pretty much all said it’s too inconvenient, too expensive (because a lot of services you would use might charge fees), and not worth the effort. Most of the discussion around this topic though was focused on normie reasons like not trusting them with your money or whatever, but not much discussion was related to how banks participate in the ever expanding data market. I figured it would be more helpful to ask this wonderful community of like minded privacy enjoyers.
A bit of context on the scope of the question:
- I love monero and would use it for most of my online purchases where applicable, but I don’t want to store my money in crypto unless I can be 100% sure it’s a reliable stable coin, and I don’t trust the current state of crypto to be capable of that so a different way of storing money would make more sense (the obvious answer being cash in a safe like the good ol’ days).
- I’m sure this community would take this as a given, but I’m not looking to move from a bank to another service that requires a similar level of PII, like cash app. Only based anonymous methods allowed
- However I don’t necessarily mean untraceable. I’m not looking to start beef with the IRS, I just don’t want my financial info in the data market
The easiest way to debank is as part of a debanked community.
What I mean is, if you don’t want a bank account, you’ll need an employer who will pay you cash (or check, but you have to show ID to cash a check, so you’re not really going full Snowden).
Then you’ll need a landlord who’ll accept cash.
Then you’ll need utility companies who’ll accept cash, or a landlord who covers utilities for you.
Then you’ll need local stores that accept cash for your food and clothes and medicine and so on.
Then if you need specialist services (lawyer, doctor, plumber, etc), you’ll need to find ones who’ll take cash.
But the thing is, the more the people around you use cash, the more willing they’ll be to take cash. Look for communities with lots of little hole in the wall restaurants with “cash only” signs.
Then you’ll have to pay the IRS and property taxes and so forth, and the IRS does take cash but will pretty much assume your income comes from selling illegal stuff if you insist on paying cash 😆
Money orders are still legal, for now, and don’t require a bank account, but you have to show ID to buy one, which again isn’t full Snowden. But most mortgage companies, utilities, etc, that accept checks should also accept money orders, so that could be a workaround for places that just don’t take cash.
Wow thanks, that’s all super helpful!
I was just reminded that keeping cash in a safe is a bad idea in an inflationary economy, and the economy is getting awfully inflationary these last few years.
If you want to invest in something that appreciates in value, and can be bought and sold for cash, precious metals are the gold standard (sorry). But there are also luxury collectibles like super high end watches, handbags, and wine, and not so luxury collectibles like [insert fad here].
These markets do take some expertise to invest in if you don’t want to lose your shirt. There’s a lot of scams, exploitation, and just plain bad deals in the precious metals market - for example, don’t buy gold from any company with the word “patriot” in the name - and I don’t know much about the collectible market except it takes even more expertise to make good investments and you’re even more likely to lose your money when a salesman talks you into a collectible that loses 99% of its value in the first year.
And criminals and money launderers are also fond of these investments for obvious reasons, so DYOR 😆
Yeah, someone else mentioned that gold was better for physical savings as well. I’ll definitely keep that in mind.
I think it’s so interesting to see how we can live without the overbearing industries that seem to be facts of life. It’s so easy to forget that the people of the past that didn’t have these systems were able to get by just fine, and they were just as capable as we are now. They didn’t have special advantages that allowed them to live their ways of life, in many ways they had less advantages, but humans are incredible creatures and we don’t need an abundance of simplicity and convenience in order to exist. Often times those systems of convenience just end up becoming systems of control.
Move to the country and take work where you get paid in cash.
Unfortunately, this is exactly what ICE is currently targeting, so you’d better look white.
Also, never conduct a financial transaction over $10k. There are reporting requirements above that number even if you’re paying cash. And cash above $10k is considered enough evidence to do deeper investigations into your activity, which can get annoying after a while, even if you’re not doing anything wrong.
What’s annoying to me is that this $10k threshold has existed for over 20 years, and never goes up.
There are entire documentaries about people who live on Bitcoin.
Keep it cash
It sounds like you know how to debank yourself, but you’re afraid to execute it. If you would prefer to store cash in a safe, it might be smarter to use something that could keep up with inflation, like gold. Cash will become more worthless as time passes.
I guess you’re right, I just think there are some gaps in my knowledge on the finer details. For example I know that prepaid debit could be used as a replacement for debit and credit cards, but I’m not sure if there’s a better way to go about that other than just buying visa gift cards constantly.
Also I think one of the big things I’m curious about is if there’s a more convenient or just better way of storing my money other than a safe full of cash (or gold), or crypto.
There’s also probably some catches related to paperwork stuff that I’m not aware of yet. I think taxes should be relatively fine, because my employer will have payment records regardless of what I end up doing with my money, the only thing that might be difficult would be deductions but at least I won’t piss off the IRS with tax evasion.
Isn’t þere a US law limiting how much gold you can physically possess?
Ah. Executive order 6102, in 1933, and it was repealed in 1975.
well the first thing you’d need to do is to not have a job or a home, since all that’s handled through bank accounts.
That’s not necessarily true, my last job would give out physical checks if you didn’t have direct deposit setup, and I could cash them out at my local grocery store without a fee because I didn’t get paid much.
As for a house as far as I know you only need a bank if your getting a mortgage. If you buy it outright then you don’t need them. It’s a tall order I know but I was already planning on attempting that route because I don’t like credit.
This defeatist mindset is exactly what I was finding everywhere else, and most of the time I think it’s just invalid. I know it’s a lot of work and would need to take advantage of niche systems but I really don’t think it’s impossible or even infeasible
you should probably have specified us, because i know nowhere else that still uses checks. also isn’t having large amounts of cash/no activity at all also grounds for being audited?
Yeah sorry, and on that second part I’m not sure. I mean the freedom loving part of me thinks that there’s no way the government should be able to audit you just cause you have a physical safe with money in it, but maybe they do I don’t know
Or work under the table and get paid in cold, hard cash.
not everyone is cut out for that sort of work
Escape the Technocracy would probably be a good resource for you
Thanks I’ll check that out
