I didn’t say anything like that, though. You’re attacking a position that hasn’t been argued.
If public safety is the goal, maximizing the number of drivers that are driving an appropriate speed and following the rules of the road is the pathway to success. Utilizing marked cars on patrol accomplishes this, as already noted earlier. Having varied patrol routes would keep reasonable people from assuming there were “safe” speeding areas, so reasonable people would choose not to risk speeding in order to avoid consequences.
If punishment and money extraction is the goal, sure, unmarked cars are the best bet. I would argue that public safety should be the goal, though.
Public safety is the goal. Some people don’t learn to follow speed limits and do full stops at reds or other road rules until they have had a consequence from it. I’d rather they learn that lesson through a speeding ticket than accidental manslaughter of a pedestrian.
Unmarked cruisers gives a cop a more unbiased view of the reality of traffic flow/conditions than a marked cruiser cause most drivers will notice a marked cruiser and drive accordingly. Ultimately road safety is many many factors, but i believe enforcement of the rules is one of them.
Just look at the pushback against automated speed cameras, even the ones in school zones often get vanadalized. Many drivers only give a shit about a speed limit because of fines and their insurance costs.
Automated speed cameras are also bullshit though… How much of a police state are people actually on board with? Holy moly… I really don’t think we need, nor should we accept, robots policing us.
Actual good patrolling along varied or semi-random routes is the way you illustrate to the public that you are watching for people to be on their best behavior, not playing “gotcha” style entrapment games. Show people you are there and actually interested in their safety.
Yea the whole “gotcha” of exceeding a posted speed limit in area where a sign often warns you a camera is checking your speed in a position the municipality will often publicly announce its presence. Real gotcha moment.
Y’all are bitching cops shouldn’t be allowed to enforce speed limits, we have a modern solution that is often deployed in areas with high pedestrian injury rates and you’re calling it some mass surveillance state.
The internet is doing far worse things to your privacy than a speed camera. Dont trust them? Your city probably has a map of them on their website. Dont drive or walk that specific spot.
I feel like the people doing traffic enforcement should be different than the police. Like, they shouldn’t have guns and authority to search and murder. Just, like, a radar gun. and the authority to issue tickets and direct traffic.
It’s a thought, but unfortunately any member of an ‘authority’ is going to be in harm’s way with a real criminal. Remember that (as an example) the son of sam and the oklahoma city bomber were both caught because of ticketing, and that a great many felons (like, actual felons that we care about, not the ‘felons’ of trump gang ™ that have the wrong skin color) are encountered on traffic stops. I wouldn’t want kindly and vulnerable meter maids to be expected to interact with people who have everything to lose, or hostile sovereign citizen types.
If a traffic enforcement type were to work, they’d have to have the authority to detain, and that inevitably means conflict with someone. I’d rather it not be with meter maid sally, and rather with officer dickstain, where I’m happy if either or both party gets hurt.
I don’t think the average person is so dangerous that it justifies having driving infractions be handled with firearms by default.
I don’t think you even need to force a stop. If they don’t stop when asked to pull over, you have the license plate. That’s registered. Send them a ticket or court summons. If they refuse to come to court, then you can have some muscular folks go resolve the issue.
Granted, I’m just spitballing. But I don’t think the current system works at all.
I agree with you. ACAB. In the future I want, I’m sure there will be a need for some form of law enforcement, but right now it’s beyond fucked.
I just want to acknowledge that while the system needs to be torn down, I also don’t think we can implement a ‘nice face’ traffic enforcement without consequences right now. I don’t know. I’m just some idiot spitballing as well. Hopefully iron sharpens iron.
This is the biggest point. There are countless bodycam footage available of some crazy shit going down at traffic stops. Someone with an active warrant is going to resist being IDd. Someone high on cocaine in a stolen car may not act rationally.
I think the aim is to get people to slow down even when there isn’t a cop, since one could always be around. It doesn’t really work that well and is a poor substitute for good road design, but still.
I’m pretty sure some places use the traffic ticketing as income, which is a huge perverse incentive. Or maybe they just have quotas. Or benefit from seizing property from people. The police are a problem, but i’m sure this community is aware.
Drivers need to be ready to stop or swerve for any reason at any time. A dog crossing a road, an accident in front of them, an emergency vehicle passing. If you slam into the car in front of you because they slowed down to the speed limit, that is your fault.
I love that you are voted negative on this. You’re absolutely correct, but people don’t want to hear it.
Had a long argument with someone a few months back where they insisted if they come around a curve and a tree is laying across the road, and they can’t stop in time, the tree is at fault…
Drivers will slow down an behave when they see a marked cruiser. For traffic enforcement i don’t mind undercover cruisers.
Getting people to slow down and behave is the entire point though?
If that only works when they see a police cruiser then we are going to need a lot more cops. Like, a lot.
I didn’t say anything like that, though. You’re attacking a position that hasn’t been argued.
If public safety is the goal, maximizing the number of drivers that are driving an appropriate speed and following the rules of the road is the pathway to success. Utilizing marked cars on patrol accomplishes this, as already noted earlier. Having varied patrol routes would keep reasonable people from assuming there were “safe” speeding areas, so reasonable people would choose not to risk speeding in order to avoid consequences.
If punishment and money extraction is the goal, sure, unmarked cars are the best bet. I would argue that public safety should be the goal, though.
Public safety is the goal. Some people don’t learn to follow speed limits and do full stops at reds or other road rules until they have had a consequence from it. I’d rather they learn that lesson through a speeding ticket than accidental manslaughter of a pedestrian.
Unmarked cruisers gives a cop a more unbiased view of the reality of traffic flow/conditions than a marked cruiser cause most drivers will notice a marked cruiser and drive accordingly. Ultimately road safety is many many factors, but i believe enforcement of the rules is one of them.
Just look at the pushback against automated speed cameras, even the ones in school zones often get vanadalized. Many drivers only give a shit about a speed limit because of fines and their insurance costs.
Automated speed cameras are also bullshit though… How much of a police state are people actually on board with? Holy moly… I really don’t think we need, nor should we accept, robots policing us.
Actual good patrolling along varied or semi-random routes is the way you illustrate to the public that you are watching for people to be on their best behavior, not playing “gotcha” style entrapment games. Show people you are there and actually interested in their safety.
Yea the whole “gotcha” of exceeding a posted speed limit in area where a sign often warns you a camera is checking your speed in a position the municipality will often publicly announce its presence. Real gotcha moment.
So police should hide behind bushes, use unmarked cars, and also deploy cameras to watch and make sure no one gets out of line. K.
Yay, surveillance state!
Y’all are bitching cops shouldn’t be allowed to enforce speed limits, we have a modern solution that is often deployed in areas with high pedestrian injury rates and you’re calling it some mass surveillance state.
The internet is doing far worse things to your privacy than a speed camera. Dont trust them? Your city probably has a map of them on their website. Dont drive or walk that specific spot.
I feel like the people doing traffic enforcement should be different than the police. Like, they shouldn’t have guns and authority to search and murder. Just, like, a radar gun. and the authority to issue tickets and direct traffic.
It’s a thought, but unfortunately any member of an ‘authority’ is going to be in harm’s way with a real criminal. Remember that (as an example) the son of sam and the oklahoma city bomber were both caught because of ticketing, and that a great many felons (like, actual felons that we care about, not the ‘felons’ of trump gang ™ that have the wrong skin color) are encountered on traffic stops. I wouldn’t want kindly and vulnerable meter maids to be expected to interact with people who have everything to lose, or hostile sovereign citizen types.
If a traffic enforcement type were to work, they’d have to have the authority to detain, and that inevitably means conflict with someone. I’d rather it not be with meter maid sally, and rather with officer dickstain, where I’m happy if either or both party gets hurt.
I don’t think the average person is so dangerous that it justifies having driving infractions be handled with firearms by default.
I don’t think you even need to force a stop. If they don’t stop when asked to pull over, you have the license plate. That’s registered. Send them a ticket or court summons. If they refuse to come to court, then you can have some muscular folks go resolve the issue.
Granted, I’m just spitballing. But I don’t think the current system works at all.
I agree with you. ACAB. In the future I want, I’m sure there will be a need for some form of law enforcement, but right now it’s beyond fucked.
I just want to acknowledge that while the system needs to be torn down, I also don’t think we can implement a ‘nice face’ traffic enforcement without consequences right now. I don’t know. I’m just some idiot spitballing as well. Hopefully iron sharpens iron.
This is the biggest point. There are countless bodycam footage available of some crazy shit going down at traffic stops. Someone with an active warrant is going to resist being IDd. Someone high on cocaine in a stolen car may not act rationally.
Shouldn’t that be the whole point? Get people to slow down and behave? Or is punishment the entire purpose?
I think the aim is to get people to slow down even when there isn’t a cop, since one could always be around. It doesn’t really work that well and is a poor substitute for good road design, but still.
I’m pretty sure some places use the traffic ticketing as income, which is a huge perverse incentive. Or maybe they just have quotas. Or benefit from seizing property from people. The police are a problem, but i’m sure this community is aware.
Behave? Causing people to suddenly slow down or slam on their brakes, and go 5-10 mph under the speed limit is infinitely more dangerous
Drivers need to be ready to stop or swerve for any reason at any time. A dog crossing a road, an accident in front of them, an emergency vehicle passing. If you slam into the car in front of you because they slowed down to the speed limit, that is your fault.
Well if you get rear ended at least you can take solace in it being the other person’s fault.
So is your solution to someone following too closely to just speed up?
Is that what I said?
I love that you are voted negative on this. You’re absolutely correct, but people don’t want to hear it.
Had a long argument with someone a few months back where they insisted if they come around a curve and a tree is laying across the road, and they can’t stop in time, the tree is at fault…