Very much depends on the area. I’m in a middle class (what’s left of it) neighborhood and to send my 2 kids to daycare is about $2400 a month. $2000/month for a single kid would be a pretty nice day care in a fairly expensive city.
Decent houses in France typically cost more than a castle. Nobody wants a castle.
It seems fun until you look at the upkeep and maintenance fees. The initial price is peanuts.
I don’t have a full analysis, but at least this source points at 1500 to be the high end of the expensive cities in Germany, with public care as low as 100.
So is 2000 a “normal” value in many areas, or a high end of some?
I have the feeling this is inflated and we just accept.
Berlin, for example, is one of the regions where daycare is completely free (with the exception of some minor surcharges for food etc.)
And from my knowledge daycare in Germany costs generally between 0 and about 300 Euros per month and child. The cost depends more on the local state’s and/or city’s laws than whether it’s an expensive city or rural area.
Also the differentiation in cost between public and private is often not a thing (depends on the state).
I’m not saying that there won’t exist some fancy private daycare centres for 1500 or more, but they would certainly be an extremely rare exception operating out of the “normal” system anyway…
$3000 is average in the big cities for infant care in a daycare center, and it drops down to about $2000 for toddlers.
Some places have options for home-based care where a person can get licensed to take care of children in their own home, and the prices are generally about half of that of the center-based care.
One big issue is ratios. If the wage for a child care worker is $30/hour including the cost of paid vacation, health insurance, and you need coverage for 9 hours per day, 5 days a week, while needing to maintain one teacher for every 4 kids, that’s $340/week or about $1450/month for labor alone, assuming no overtime and perfect staffing ratios. Throw in food, rent, utilities, insurance, other operational expenses, and it’s pretty much impossible to provide care for less than $2000/month per child on the costs side.
I checked for Netherlands and it seems to be easily over 2k a month for fulltime care (172-240 hours).
The thing I wasn’t aware of is the subsidies low income parents receive. Up to 96%. Seems to be a bit lower in practice, but still almost all is covered.
That doesn’t account for high cost areas, and is dependent on income. But the conclusion seems to be that it’s far cheaper than I mentioned for the end consumer.
Even the most expensive states are averaged out between cheap suburban and rural areas and the actual expensive cities where the jobs are. $2000/month would be an unbelievable bargain in cities like San Francisco or New York.
I sort of agree, because no one should be shamed. The issue I have with the statement is that current “trad wife” trends are at best exclusive and at their worst completely toxic. I definitely don’t want to see that either.
Let’s just leave it at: let every woman choose themselves and make it as easy as possible for those who do want to do paid work.
Stay at home parents should get paid. If free daycare would cost the government $20 a day, offer stay at home parents $10 a day and you save money while allowing people to raise their kids instead of strangers.
Lets promote stay at home dads too. No reason to make this a gendered thing
Or we could have 2 day shifts of 20 hours and parents could each work one, that way neither is particularly vulnerable to financial abuse and neither has to sacrifice as much of raising their children.
It can depend of state to state too. In Oklahoma, our cost of living is considered low but we have a high poverty rate. Our median income per household is 67k, and single income is 35k. Childcare for infants averages around $800 a month
Is that for real? That’s more than (many) private schools in Europe.
Very much depends on the area. I’m in a middle class (what’s left of it) neighborhood and to send my 2 kids to daycare is about $2400 a month. $2000/month for a single kid would be a pretty nice day care in a fairly expensive city.
A 2 bedroom 1 bathroom house in Toronto costs more than a castle in france
Decent houses in France typically cost more than a castle. Nobody wants a castle.
It seems fun until you look at the upkeep and maintenance fees. The initial price is peanuts.
Well to be fair, that’s what it costs in many European countries, too.
That’s why many women don’t work. The cost is basically as high as a low paying or part time job.
That’s why everyone needs free daycare. That will generate a higher GDP for everyone.
https://www.daycarefee.com/countries/germany/
I don’t have a full analysis, but at least this source points at 1500 to be the high end of the expensive cities in Germany, with public care as low as 100.
So is 2000 a “normal” value in many areas, or a high end of some?
I have the feeling this is inflated and we just accept.
Sorry, but that source is completely wrong.
Berlin, for example, is one of the regions where daycare is completely free (with the exception of some minor surcharges for food etc.)
And from my knowledge daycare in Germany costs generally between 0 and about 300 Euros per month and child. The cost depends more on the local state’s and/or city’s laws than whether it’s an expensive city or rural area.
Also the differentiation in cost between public and private is often not a thing (depends on the state).
I’m not saying that there won’t exist some fancy private daycare centres for 1500 or more, but they would certainly be an extremely rare exception operating out of the “normal” system anyway…
The source doesn’t say it’s the norm, but there very high end, an extreme.
The low was 0 to 50
I’m just pointing out how even the outlets are not close to 2000, as somebody said.
$3000 is average in the big cities for infant care in a daycare center, and it drops down to about $2000 for toddlers.
Some places have options for home-based care where a person can get licensed to take care of children in their own home, and the prices are generally about half of that of the center-based care.
One big issue is ratios. If the wage for a child care worker is $30/hour including the cost of paid vacation, health insurance, and you need coverage for 9 hours per day, 5 days a week, while needing to maintain one teacher for every 4 kids, that’s $340/week or about $1450/month for labor alone, assuming no overtime and perfect staffing ratios. Throw in food, rent, utilities, insurance, other operational expenses, and it’s pretty much impossible to provide care for less than $2000/month per child on the costs side.
Thanks for sharing.
I checked for Netherlands and it seems to be easily over 2k a month for fulltime care (172-240 hours).
The thing I wasn’t aware of is the subsidies low income parents receive. Up to 96%. Seems to be a bit lower in practice, but still almost all is covered.
That doesn’t account for high cost areas, and is dependent on income. But the conclusion seems to be that it’s far cheaper than I mentioned for the end consumer.
https://illumine.app/blog/how-much-childcare-costs-by-state-in-usa
So 2000 a month is greater than the max of the range in the most expensive states.
All values are crazy, don’t get me wrong. But less crazy than originally stated.
Even the most expensive states are averaged out between cheap suburban and rural areas and the actual expensive cities where the jobs are. $2000/month would be an unbelievable bargain in cities like San Francisco or New York.
Daycare is like a fraction of actually raising a child.
Outside of daycare:
There’s diapers. There’s meals. There’s meds. There’s clothes and recreational material.
I have a toddler, I’m aware
They said cost of daycare, that’s what I’m inquiring about. If somebody wants to share and discuss full cost that’s fine, but a different thing.
Interesting point. We should re-normalize the idea of the stay-at-home mom.
Let’s be real, the people who promoted women going to work were almost always willing to shame those who decided not to. Let’s stop doing that.
I sort of agree, because no one should be shamed. The issue I have with the statement is that current “trad wife” trends are at best exclusive and at their worst completely toxic. I definitely don’t want to see that either.
Let’s just leave it at: let every woman choose themselves and make it as easy as possible for those who do want to do paid work.
As a stay-at-home mom, you need to let people make that choice.
Having to do something because of finances isn’t a choice.
Stay at home parents should get paid. If free daycare would cost the government $20 a day, offer stay at home parents $10 a day and you save money while allowing people to raise their kids instead of strangers.
$10 a day? What is this 1915?
Lets promote stay at home dads too. No reason to make this a gendered thing
Or we could have 2 day shifts of 20 hours and parents could each work one, that way neither is particularly vulnerable to financial abuse and neither has to sacrifice as much of raising their children.
What in the tradwife?
Well you see it’s actually empowering because it’s the only way they can afford it. /s
https://blog.dol.gov/2024/09/30/we-analyzed-5-years-worth-of-childcare-prices-heres-what-we-found#%3A~%3Atext=Monthly+childcare+prices+in+2018%2Cof+a+family's+median+income).
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/05/15/business/child-care-cost-average-annual
It can depend of state to state too. In Oklahoma, our cost of living is considered low but we have a high poverty rate. Our median income per household is 67k, and single income is 35k. Childcare for infants averages around $800 a month