I never said Canonical’s store isn’t proprietary. I said the statements in Mint’s anti-snap screed are factually incorrect.
What irritates me is all the “lol ubuntu sux” posts showing me that the quality of the discourse is declining. There are valid criticisms, but there are also invalid criticisms. And the recent string of anti-Ubuntu memes has been clearly in the latter. So yeah, I will mock those, and it’s nothing to do with insecurities. Are you sure you’re not just projecting?
I laugh over anti Arch / openSuse memes just as hard, if the meme based on something that is kinda true and not just some preconception or rumor.
Thing is that a lot arch user have to struggle with ubuntu at work and see how a lot is just more complicated and harder to set up without any seeable reason. And of course, using Ubuntu feels like using a PC with your parents in the back warning you about any shit you already have done 1000 times.
I don’t feel attacked by them, I feel irritated by some of them. The ones that irritate me are ones that repeat misinformation or otherwise harm the discourse, and that goes for memes that attack any distro like that.
Funny enough, arch is a distro I can’t stand because of the (IMO) backwards and stupid ways it does a lot of things, making it harder to set up without any good reason. But I’m not out there spamming the place with “lol arch sux” memes about that.
I don’t see what is so difficult und hard about typing archinstall and hitting enter 🤔
Even more “easy”, use endeavourOS GUI installation and than all you need is yay for your wishes
I spent about 10x more time maintaining ubuntu (“easy”debian) at work VS maintaining my endeavourOS (easy Arch) at home, because of all the “safeguards”, “easy, intuitive” design etc. and finding all those repos/ random deb files.
And I need ubuntu only for some WSL stuff windows can’t handle
The counter to low-quality “Ubuntu sux” posts is not low quality “nuh uh it’s actually super epic!!!” posts, but that’s all we ever get. I’ve seen this pattern for probably fifteen years now, and it’s exhausting. If you don’t care about the criticisms and want to keep using it, then keep using it. More power to you. I probably use things you think are garbage. Hell, Windows users think we both use garbage. I’m just tired of people desperate to justify their choices like they need to “prove” something to everyone who disagrees.
There are plenty of high quality takedowns of Ubuntu, but so rarely are there high quality defenses of it, generally because the criticisms are correct. Nobody ever talks about what makes Ubuntu good, not even Ubuntu users. Arch users will yap your ear off about ArchWiki and AUR. I’ll evangelize Nix to anybody who will listen as the future of advanced Linux management. OpenSUSE Tumbleweed fans will not shut up about rollbacks and bleeding edge software. Fedora users… well, Fedora users are usually busy out there actually doing productive things with their time instead of pointless internet squabbles.
But what is Ubuntu strong at? I genuinely have no idea. All I ever see Ubuntu users say is that it “sucks the least”, in some vague indescribable way. That it’s not as bad as everyone says, that Snaps are actually fine, etc. Always on the defensive. If Ubuntu is actually good, somebody needs to get out there and make a case for what it’s good at, besides being featured as the default instructions for running proprietary third-party software.
Okay, I’ll start. Ubuntu is good at providing a way to test and build packages for platforms you don’t necessarily have access to, for free. And because Launchpad does snap builds, that extends to those too. I have in the past used Launchpad builds to generate debugging information that solved an architecture-specific bug I wasn’t able to reproduce in QEMU and which would otherwise have remained a mystery due to my lack of access to 6 figures worth of mainframe. And I didn’t have to be an Ubuntu maintainer or anything for that. I just had to have a free Launchpad account.
Your example of Ubuntu being a good desktop is a web service run by Canonical that is relevant to maybe 1% of users, if not less?
Look, I’m happy that it works great for your use case. But this doesn’t matter to most users, and it’s also not even intrinsic to Ubuntu itself. OpenSUSE also has fantastic build services. Basically all major git services do too.
Launchpad is the basis of Ubuntu. And while OBS is pretty good, it’s nowhere near as good as Launchpad. And what Launchpad does helps speed up Linux development in many ways.
Another example though, that’s maybe more relevant: Ubuntu made it super easy for me to swap out CUPS on 22.04 with the latest version (published as a snap) that added a driver for a printer we needed. On most LTS type distros, doing something like that is painful. On Ubuntu, it was incredibly simple.
I never said Canonical’s store isn’t proprietary. I said the statements in Mint’s anti-snap screed are factually incorrect.
What irritates me is all the “lol ubuntu sux” posts showing me that the quality of the discourse is declining. There are valid criticisms, but there are also invalid criticisms. And the recent string of anti-Ubuntu memes has been clearly in the latter. So yeah, I will mock those, and it’s nothing to do with insecurities. Are you sure you’re not just projecting?
Don’t feel attacked by anti ubuntu posts
I laugh over anti Arch / openSuse memes just as hard, if the meme based on something that is kinda true and not just some preconception or rumor.
Thing is that a lot arch user have to struggle with ubuntu at work and see how a lot is just more complicated and harder to set up without any seeable reason. And of course, using Ubuntu feels like using a PC with your parents in the back warning you about any shit you already have done 1000 times.
I don’t feel attacked by them, I feel irritated by some of them. The ones that irritate me are ones that repeat misinformation or otherwise harm the discourse, and that goes for memes that attack any distro like that.
Funny enough, arch is a distro I can’t stand because of the (IMO) backwards and stupid ways it does a lot of things, making it harder to set up without any good reason. But I’m not out there spamming the place with “lol arch sux” memes about that.
I don’t see what is so difficult und hard about typing archinstall and hitting enter 🤔
Even more “easy”, use endeavourOS GUI installation and than all you need is yay for your wishes
I spent about 10x more time maintaining ubuntu (“easy”debian) at work VS maintaining my endeavourOS (easy Arch) at home, because of all the “safeguards”, “easy, intuitive” design etc. and finding all those repos/ random deb files.
And I need ubuntu only for some WSL stuff windows can’t handle
I think you’re missing the point and getting defensive about arch.
No, I just don’t like your misinformation
The counter to low-quality “Ubuntu sux” posts is not low quality “nuh uh it’s actually super epic!!!” posts, but that’s all we ever get. I’ve seen this pattern for probably fifteen years now, and it’s exhausting. If you don’t care about the criticisms and want to keep using it, then keep using it. More power to you. I probably use things you think are garbage. Hell, Windows users think we both use garbage. I’m just tired of people desperate to justify their choices like they need to “prove” something to everyone who disagrees.
There are plenty of high quality takedowns of Ubuntu, but so rarely are there high quality defenses of it, generally because the criticisms are correct. Nobody ever talks about what makes Ubuntu good, not even Ubuntu users. Arch users will yap your ear off about ArchWiki and AUR. I’ll evangelize Nix to anybody who will listen as the future of advanced Linux management. OpenSUSE Tumbleweed fans will not shut up about rollbacks and bleeding edge software. Fedora users… well, Fedora users are usually busy out there actually doing productive things with their time instead of pointless internet squabbles.
But what is Ubuntu strong at? I genuinely have no idea. All I ever see Ubuntu users say is that it “sucks the least”, in some vague indescribable way. That it’s not as bad as everyone says, that Snaps are actually fine, etc. Always on the defensive. If Ubuntu is actually good, somebody needs to get out there and make a case for what it’s good at, besides being featured as the default instructions for running proprietary third-party software.
Okay, I’ll start. Ubuntu is good at providing a way to test and build packages for platforms you don’t necessarily have access to, for free. And because Launchpad does snap builds, that extends to those too. I have in the past used Launchpad builds to generate debugging information that solved an architecture-specific bug I wasn’t able to reproduce in QEMU and which would otherwise have remained a mystery due to my lack of access to 6 figures worth of mainframe. And I didn’t have to be an Ubuntu maintainer or anything for that. I just had to have a free Launchpad account.
distroboxInagine paying 100’000$ for distrobox 🤭
(They told six figures, didn’t they?)
Your example of Ubuntu being a good desktop is a web service run by Canonical that is relevant to maybe 1% of users, if not less?
Look, I’m happy that it works great for your use case. But this doesn’t matter to most users, and it’s also not even intrinsic to Ubuntu itself. OpenSUSE also has fantastic build services. Basically all major git services do too.
Launchpad is the basis of Ubuntu. And while OBS is pretty good, it’s nowhere near as good as Launchpad. And what Launchpad does helps speed up Linux development in many ways.
Another example though, that’s maybe more relevant: Ubuntu made it super easy for me to swap out CUPS on 22.04 with the latest version (published as a snap) that added a driver for a printer we needed. On most LTS type distros, doing something like that is painful. On Ubuntu, it was incredibly simple.