- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
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If you’re considering buying one you might want to take into account that they removed the headphone jack so they can sell their own wireless buds and headphones.
I care less about the lack of a headphone jack and more about the lack of multiple ports
USB C is genuinely a great multiport, but all of these companies leave the phone with one port. People would care less if each phone had two ports, so you could plug in headphones via adapter while also charging
There are actually dongles which have both an audio jack and a USB c port. I never used one of those dongles though
I have. They tend to be poorly shielded so you get all kinds of hiss and other shenanigans in the audio when you’re charging and listening at the same time. The adapters exist, but I’ve yet to come across one that isn’t terrible.
Those suck worse than the old school 3.5mm splitters we all used back in the discman, and later iPod days.
The removal of the headphone jack is one of the worst developments in personal electronics over the last 30 years. Personally I hope that the EU’s next port mandate forces its reintroduction as Bluetooth headphones are an environmental catastrophe.
The lack of headphone jack is the sole reason I went with Samsung XCover 6Pro instead. Shame really, because I’m the kind of person who uses their device for +5 years, and prefer fixing stuff myself, but when Apple removed the headphone jack I made a decision to never buy a device without one if there’s an alternative with it and I’m still sticking with that. I bought an “outdated” laptop aswell because the newer model didn’t have USB-A, HDMI or a card reader. Ironically the most recent models now do.
Ironically the most recent models now do.
Not really ironic. They’re all just copying whatever Apple does, and they backtracked on that stupid decision.
It’s Apple I’m talking about
you mean this strange old socket that is (at least for me) primarily used for collecting dust since almost a decade? yeah, personally I can live without it.
and this fortunately is not apple. You can use every brand of earbud and use all of the features, so I don’t really get your point at all. the phone is very good and I hope I will be able to use it until the 30s
Having a headphone jack will let you use any kind of headphone produced in the last 50 years, which has a 3.5mm jack. Also, while listening to music you could also charge your phone, if you choose to, but not with a USB-C only port. Furthermore, USB-C DACs are stupid, they are an annoyance, even the ones with the shortest cables - I broke three of them in two months because they’re idiotically designed and they don’t fold in my pocket - a thing that never happened with headphone cables.
You also don’t get a noticeable delay on the audio, which imo makes watching any video horrible
Two years in and providing a USB-C adapter my wife is still complaining that her current phone doesn’t have a headphone jack.
For my daughter I selected the phone mostly for repairability combined with colour choice, which landed me with Nokia - which ended up having a headphone jack. Didn’t pay attention to that, but she’s happy it is there.
Out of curiosity, what features are restricted on iPhones for off-brand earbuds?
Tell me a pair of wireless headphones that are as good and around the same price as the moondrop Aria’s with extremely low latency (so they can be used for rhythm games) and can buy a replacement case for not too much.
Also Bluetooth’s audio quality is terrible when also using the microphone at the same time. So you can’t really make a call and enjoy listening to music at the same time
I agree with you, but why would you make a calla and listen to music at the same time?
I used to do it all the time during Corona while being home schooled.
Or when you simply just want to watch a video together.
I got a 30 dollar pair of knockoff ipods for my Samsung and the audio quality is better than the wired akg buds it came with. They also sell for less now. No issues with battery life and the case has a battery level display. They also can be wirelessly charged. They’re my favorites.
I always plug in my car stereo to that old socket in my car…
You might want to look into a bluetooth to FM radio dongle
I tried one, it sucked balls, it was a cheap brand though, so I’m open to recommendations.
That was one of the main reasons I was interested in their phones :/
I miss that modular phone people went crazy about for a week or 2 until it died out
Google bought and killed it
I just keep a USB c dongle permanently attached to my wired headphones, I forget it’s there. It adds like 1" to the overall cable length. I basically just converted all my wired headphones into USB c headphones.
Any evidence for that theory? I guess I’ve used Bluetooth hesdphones for years, so I’ve not got skin in the game. Lots of android devices seem to not have a headphone jack. And each part removed is one less part to pay for, or replace, or have to water proof. I’ve not looked into it because I’m happy to trade sound quality for wireless convienece, but umarent headphones that use the usb c port comparable in quality to 3.5mm?
But if there’s a leaked memo or something that it was a concerted plan by the company that would certainly be bad.
Is this a fair argument in 2023 with all the options for wireless headphones/buds? I feel like it still sucks because you can’t use your dollar store wired sets, but there are enough cheap raycon clones out now that it’s hardly a guaranteed secondary sale at this point.
Tell me a pair of wireless headphones that are as good and around the same price as the moondrop Aria’s with extremely low latency (so they can be used for rhythm games) and can buy a replacement case for not too much.
Also Raycons are trash. Like they’re literally e-waste for how bad they are
Also Bluetooth’s audio quality is terrible when also using the microphone at the same time. So you can’t really make a call and enjoy listening to music at the same time
Who is listening to music on the same headset while making a phone call?
And why use your phone’s onboard DAC at that point if you want quality headphones?
And why use your phone’s onboard DAC at that point if you want quality headphones?
Some phones (LG) did actually come with a HQ DAC.
At that point you’re getting a very specific phone for a very specific purpose. It’s not the rule but the exception. So it doesn’t apply as a reason for any other phone. You’ve argued why the LG has a 3.5mm jack, not why Fairphone should have a 3.5mm jack. I’d also be curious as to how powerfully it can even drive headphones at that point. It must also have a stronger amplifier than most phones too. It’d be meaningless without it. What’s the point of high fidelity if it can’t drive headphones that can utilize it.
This is all getting away from the purpose of the Fairphone. It’s not a dedicated music player. It’s not advertising high fidelity music, psrticyij relation to other phones. I don’t think anyone is calling that LG phone “green” either.
Congratulations to anyone who can think of an edge case that wouldn’t apply to the Fairphone. Might as well mention a tensor chip not being in the Fairphone.
I already have a good set of headphones. I don’t want to buy new ones or adapters, especially when I can just buy a device that they can plug straight into
Look, I do understand, and it took me a while to buy into the wireless buds thing, but you could have made the same argument for PS/2 mouse and keyboards, or anything using mini, and then later, micro USB.
The fact is, if you want to keep your old peripherals, but upgrade your main compute device, at some point you need to accept that you’ll need an adapter.
The 3.5mm jack was first introduced in the 1950s as a mini version of the 6.5mm jack… which was used as far back as 1878… it’s had a hell of a run, but if you weigh the pros and cons fairly, wireless as a standard has drawbacks, but is actually, ultimately an upgrade and it’s well overdue.
I just think there are enough wireless options (and adapters) available now that it’s not fair to knock fairphone for this decision anymore.
My main issue with all of this is that I’m not interested in maintaining a charge for yet another wireless device.
I’m a frequent flier for work. My wired noise cancelling headphones run on a single AAA battery for 14+ hours straight. I can buy a small pack of AAA batteries at the airport in 30 seconds and get 60 hours of listening time. I don’t have to worry about putting them back in their carrying/charger case. I don’t have to worry about charging that case. If they go flat and I don’t have a spare AAA battery (the case actually has a convenient hole for a spare AAA), they still work, albeit with a noisier background. And they plug into in flight entertainment system headphone sockets. Haven’t seen a Bluetooth option on IFE systems yet.
Would I want to go jogging with my wired headphones? No. I do have a pair of bose wireless earbuds, and they’re nice. But every time I think about using them, they are flat in their charging case. I don’t want to have to keep the charging case on charge soooooo for 90 percent of my usage , the wired ones it is.
My noise-canceling, Bluetooth headphones in 2004 ran for 2 days, no problem (back when I was flying for work all the time).
“Another thing to charge” is a strawman. They all use C or micro today, and headphones use so little power your laptop can easily charge them. Or even your phone.
“Another thing to charge” is a strawman.
They are not functional for the time it takes to get a useful charge into them. I’ll just pause that movie and pop my buds back into their charging case for a while, it’s so convenient. So, like I said, you have to maintain their charge, alongside the other devices that have to have their charge maintained.
A lot of it has to do with BLE running constantly in the background (things like find my buds, “easy connect” features with their own management app tend to use it). If you fly like, once a week , and have a headset for flying, you need to check on its charge, as BLE will slowly grind it down to nothing while it sits in your travel bag.
My noise-canceling, Bluetooth headphones in 2004 ran for 2 days, no problem (back when I was flying for work all the time).
What brand were they? I bought my current set of Bose corded noise cancelling headphones in 2015 precisely because battery life in Bluetooth products was still reasonably abysmal. I’m guessing that they were one of the very first sets to come out, seeing that regular consumer Bluetooth headphones only appeared on the market in 2003.
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Yeah I think so too
Also, it doesn’t feature a serial port. This phone is almost useless. /s
You forgot PS/2. No one’s gonna use this USB thing, it sucks.
I might get flack for this but I despise them for their greenwashing. removing the headphone jack to sell their own Bluetooth headphones was mmmmmmh move at best.
I agree removing the headphone jack is annoying, but I’m sure the Bluetooth works with any device that supports the format, not just theirs. Apple tries to push Apple stuff and they know their stupid user base will buy the Apple version if they have it, but I doubt the same is true here. If they had a wired and wireless headphone, would you suspect them to be trying to force you to buy their headphones still with the 5mm jack?
I despise people repeating comments. How is making the device cheaper, more sustainable, and more reliable greenwashing? I would love anybody who just loves complaining about the headphones jack to explain that. No one else has. I doubt anybody complaining really cares about the environment either. What phone do you currently have?
The usual argument is “FP5 bad because no headphone jack, I choose Nokia or Samsung”… I guess if you’re not even trying to have a fair and sustainable supply chain, that’s totally fine.
Don’t have many options if i need the headphone jack
You have $5 options.
can’t get a phone for 5$
You can get a phone jack adapter for $5 moron.
shit solution, spend more money to fix a design fuckup
How is removing the jack making the device more sustainable or reliable?
It allowed them to increase the IP rating, allows for simplified manufacturing, and easier maintainability and repairability.
How is not including it considered greenwashing (I notice you didn’t ask about that, so I assume you know the answer)?
Plenty of electronics have been able to get IP ratings while still having headphone jacks. It’s a trivial part to include as it is practically an ancient bit of tech and doesn’t introduce some kind of massive complexity to the device. Repair is a simple swap of the module. Nothing you’re saying has anything to do with supporting your claim of its removal leading to greater sustainability or reliability. Its materials are no different from the rest of the phone, meaning it’s just as sustainable as the rest of the parts, and it’s not a part that’s prone to failure, meaning it’s just as reliable as the rest.
The main thing about Fairphone is not the phone but the supply chain.
https://www.fairphone.com/en/impact/
Nothing is perfect and a phone cannot make happy every one (is there a jack or not …). But I’m happy that they try to make a good phone with all the hidden things in mind (from where come from the rough material, who is making the pieces and in which conditions …). That’s more important for me then the final product.
Yeah when I need to get a new phone I’m 100% getting a FairPhone. My last phone lived for multiple years past the security updates. All my phones over the years have died to some trivial problem that wasn’t worth fixing (e.g. bad charging port). But a fixable phone with eight years of security updates? Sign me the fuck up. The only reason my current phone isn’t a FairPhone is because they didn’t sell in the US when I needed a new one.
I’m contemplating getting the fairphone 5. The usb c port on my last few phones were getting very loose at the end of the use. Making it a hassle using it in my car. One steep curve, and the phone slides making the connection get loose.
If I get the fairphone 5 I will immediately get a USB c replacement for future proofing.
It’s annoying charging my phone at night and waking up to an almost empty phone because the cable got loose when I set it on my bedside table.
I had to replace the USB C port on my Fairphone 3, took about €30 and 10 minutes.
In any other phone it would’ve meant getting a complete new device
It’s actually surprisingly easy to do on a OnePlus 5T. I did it after cleaning out the port wasn’t good enough anymore (my phone was bought secondhand/refurb, and I also recently replaced the battery too . - overall the cost of both endeavours including the cheapo kit to get the thing open in the first place was on the order of £25, though I did lose the two screws for the USB port that connext it to the bottom, still works fine with the other two internal screws though 🤣).
Eventually secondhand parts will stop being available on ebay, but for now its all good ;p. Though if your screen breaks it’s probably not worth it to replace, that part alone seems to be half the secondhand-price of a lot of phones all on it’s own >.<
I have replaced a micro usb port on an old phone before. But because it’s hard soldered it takes a lot of effort and time. I wouldn’t want to try that with usb c because it has way more leads.
Some devices have the port on the mobo. I canonly think ione I’ve owned like this.
All my other phones it’s been replaceable.
Meh, I could replace entire bottom board on my Xiaomi Mi4 in about 10 minutes. Way back in 2014, best phone I’ve ever owned.
Probably not your problem, but my completely different phone (oneplus 7 pro)has been pretty solid. But, lint and dust gathered into the port, making some of the plugs extremely loose to the point it would fall out from the weight of the cable… I took a needle and scraped out the compacted lint at the bottom. (avoiding touching the middle thing in the port. Good as new afterwards, even the one cable I’ve been using with the phone since 2019 which is pretty loose after use now, still sits without problems when moving the phone around.
But I’d definitely suggest cleaning it out if you haven’t. Even the small specs you get out makes a big difference. My powerbank came wouldn’t stay in, after cleaning it’s more well behaved. But there’s a clear difference in USB-c plugs and how they fit phones.
Had that issue before, annoying as fuck. My latest one has a case with a small cap for the USBC port. Eliminated the problem. Love it.
Thanks, I have a oneplus 7T and I have been cleaning it. It’s just very loose now. Been scraping the harder to clean parts with a toothpick, and the rest with a toothbrush. It just isn’t working for me. Might have to try a needle now.
If the 7T is constructed anything like the 5T then replacing the USB port is an inexpensive and relatively easy weekend project. You just undo a couple of T5 screws, pop off the back, undo a couple more screws and replace the assembly. The hard part is not losing the screws.
Considering software support period is over I don’t think it’s worth the hassle of getting the back off. The oneplus security update period is also abysmal.
I looked up how to get the back off.
Also a reason I’m contemplating the fairphone 5. Just pull off the back and a few screws later it’s pretty much done. I don’t want to mess with a heat gun to open up my phone.
These comments remind me about how when you try to do something great, the vast majority of the feedback will be from people who were never going to buy into your idea in the first place. The fact that they’re on version 5 tells me there’s demand for an ethically sourced, user-repairable phone with a long support life. Go start your own phone company if you don’t like it.
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The Fairphone 4 did eventually make it to the US, so I’m hopeful that we’ll eventually get the 5 too. According to GSMArena it already supports the necessary LTE/5G bands for my US network.
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Bummer.
Looks like it has all the necessary bands for Australian networks, too, so this seems like a licensing/distribution issue more than a technical issue. I really hope they release globally at some point. I will consider importing one if I can find it at a good price.
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Can’t get one off eBay or something?
I really wanted to get this phone, but at 850Eur that’s a hard pass from me. I could let the lack of jack and FM radio slide, as well as some design choices that they made, as sacrifices need to be made to make it modular. But I can find that hardware in phones that cost a quarter of a Fairphone. And then there is the repair cost, where the parts cost almost twice as much as getting a non-fair phone repaired at a shop (even moreso if I were to use aliexpress parts and home repair). Again, I fully expect a repairable and fair-source phone to perform worse than a regular one, but this is like paying iPhone money for a Xiaomi midranger.
Also, the 8 year warrranty feels like a scam because the chip they use will be out of production in 4-5 years.Are we using different websites? It’s 700 euro for me, not 850. Also it’s 5 year warranty and 8 years of updates.
Yeah, just noticed the new price. It’s not available in my country yet so I was quoting the one listed on gsmarena. At 700Eur it does make more sense, as it’s a similar price to the old Fairphone in 8gb guise.
Where’s the headphone jack?
Occasionally sluggish performance
Wonder how it will be in 5 years. Personally think you’d be better of buying high end now and keeping it longer. Also I never had any component fail on my Samsung devices (except screen but that was self inflicted and the repair prices of samsung are more than fair). Same with iPhones, they are way more durable than fairphones.
I don’t know of any high end Android phone manufacturer that promises security updates for >5 years. If you want to keep your phone that long or even longer, there are few choices unless you want to be vulnerable.
Also, I have no idea what exactly “more durable” is supposed to mean, but I’m very much certain that Apple’s and Samsung’s batteries degrade the same and their screens also crack when dropped. A replacement part and the repair will be significantly cheaper with FairPhone, especially for people who don’t want or dare to do it themselves because of anti-repair measures by the manufacturers.
For reference, a replacement screen for FP5 costs 100€ and comes with straightforward instructions from the manufacturer. An Apple screen replacement will cost you 340€ and there are no official ways to get replacement parts or do the repair yourself. You have to pay half a FP5’s worth just for an iPhone screen repair.
Edit: Spelling correction
Samsung and Google promise 5 years of updates. Google is said to provide more with the pixel 8.
Samsung charges 140 to 175 € for a repair on the s23. While almost twice as much as the fairphone, I still think its fair. I have to agree that what apple charges is way to much but that’s how it is.
As for durable I meant no random hardware fails. They are incredibly long lasting. My galaxy s4 and s6 still work to this day.
I’ve used pixel phones for a long time, but I’ll eat my hat if Google actually honors more than 5 years of updates for the pixel 8.
Sceurity updates shmecurity updates. How many stories of someone bank account being robbed through old android vunerbality have you heard about. Im not saying they are worthelss beacuse Obviusly its better to be secured than not but they really shouldnt be a factor when choosing whetewer to buy a new phone or keep using old one. Especialy if you are like a year behind or something similar.
Yep, still use my S10e which is almost 5 years old. Still as perfect as day 1. Not sure what to buy next, as small and as durable as this one…
I still use my Note 9 from time to time and it’s extremely responsive. The only thing I notice is the low refresh rate of the screen.
@redditReallySucks imo, as long as Google Play Services gets updated on your device, you shouldn’t have many issues. E.g. check how backwards compatible are apps on Android
The only reason i don’t buy it is because it’s too big. Particularly for a phone i would commit to for a longer lifespan, the physical design needs to be without compromise, and i know that the moment someone releases a half-way decent mini Android phone, i will drop whatever phone i have and buy that instead.
I fear you’ll be waiting a long time.
I fear that too. But so long as my current phone holds out, there’s no point buying into another compromise upfront.
So… The Asus Zenfone 10?
I had a Zenfone 6. It got a whopping 1 software update. It is otherwise a very nice-looking phone but that is unacceptable. And to my knowledge they haven’t committed to anything more than that.
That’s the same size as an iPhone 15 or Galaxy S23, not “mini”.
We ever figure out if this can be unlocked? I know it was then it wasn’t, etc.
As far as I know it can.
I think Sony still releases decent small phones
The smallest I’ve seen Sony recently releasing was the Xperia 5 V, which is 6.1". Similar to iPhone 15, S23, ZenFone and Pixel 8, just i think taller and narrower. I tried it in person, but it still felt ‘big’.
I already struggle with the keyboard on what I’d call a sizeable Android phone.
Luckily if you are looking for an even larger phone for a scaled up keyboard, you have plenty of options. I don’t have the same struggle with the keyboard, and would happily use a 4" screen phone if one were available.
Wish it had a jack
I don’t see the big deal about headphone jacks. If you really want wired headphones, stick a dongle on the end of the cable and leave it there. It’s almost exactly the same, except you can’t charge and listen at the same time - not really something I would worry about.
All this accomplishes is an unnecessary inconvenience. I shouldn’t have to lug additional cables, and far more importantly the choice between Wired/Wireless should be up to me, not the manufacturer
That USBC dongle will sound much much better than the weak DAC they’d pair with the headphone jack anyway.
I have a headphone jack on my 4a but I still use the dongle because the dongle can actually drive speakers.
This point is frequently overlooked imo
It’s like complaining a new PC doesn’t come with USB-A and only USB-C.
Design decisions shouldn’t always be up to the end user. Every single option can’t always be included forever and ever.
If you want wired for quality, you need a DAC anyway. If you want wired otherwise, leave the adapter on your headphones.
Don’t let your inability to adapt stifle actual developmental progress.
Removing things that loads of customers want because you want to sell them Bluetooth headphones is not progress lol
I forget, bargaining is which stage of grief?
wasn’t it the 2nd?
Do custom ROMs such as Lineage and Postmarket OS support the fairphone 5 though?
Murena is selling the Fairphone 5 with the Lineage-based /e/OS already: https://e.foundation/leaving-apple-google-murena-fairphone-5-is-here-welcome-e-os-1-14-join-the-photo-contest-e-os-2023/
Postmarketos boots on fp5 but lots if things are not yet working. I think, the main contributor is a Fairphone employee https://wiki.postmarketos.org/wiki/Fairphone_5_(fairphone-fp5) I can’t find LineageOS development progress, but Murena look like they will be selling the fp5 with e/os which is customised LineageOS, so its probably making progress.
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How would you rate CalyxOS?
CalyxOS doesn’t support the FP5 yet but they are working on it. I have been using it for like 2 years and the only thing I miss is a sensor permission like the one from GrapheneOS.
literal liberalism, it’s putting lipstick on the pig that is android, the entire system is built from the ground up to be a surveillance nightmare. Postmarket OS should work but you’ll be better off getting a used Oneplus 6/6T and waiting for camera support (soon ™ )
the entire system is built from the ground up to be a surveillance nightmare
Maybe but many have gone through the trouble of stripping the surveillance processes from it for your convenience.
It is a great OS from a functional standpoint and realistically your only other option is iOS, which comes with a whole load of other baggage.
Patches for the kernel that make the camera work exist, even though they haven’t been accepted into the kernel you could just compile it yourself. Maybe I’m not the best resource though, I hard bricked my 6T two days ago. Ubuntu Touch is also an option, it has camera support because it uses an older more custom kernel.
E OS does
My last fairphone died of a busted motherboard, which wasn’t replacable. Since then I am kinda sceptical about the “repairable” part.
The only thing that makes me cautious about this phone is the CPU. Will it still be performant in 5+ years?
I mean I’m running a FP3 from 4 years ago and literally nothing changed. Phones don’t magically get slower if they’re not filled up with bloat.
Phones don’t magically get slower
They do if you stick with the OEM’s ROM.
Technically no, the OEMs ROM is what gets slower, hence my comment about bloat.
I’m still rocking a 2017 phone, courtesy of lineage.
People are shocked how fast it is, not because it’s old (they don’t know), but because it’s faster than anything they have.
Bloat, apps running for no reason, really slow a phone down.
It felt this way for me for my last Samsung S10. Their android become an unusable mess, bloated to the brink,so I switched it to Lineage. It felt like a different phone.
That phone alone determined me to go for Pixels which allow relocking bootloader with custom roms.
Yea, Samsung was my last device that caused me to switch to AOSP and now Lineage.
Had Moto before that which was pretty good, far less bloat.
If you use your phone like 99% of people do, it will be completely fine. If you don’t do gaming or 4K video editing on your phone, there’s no problem. The CPU will even be fine for Instagram face filters for the foreseeable future
I ordered the FP5 after using my OnePlus 3T for nearly 7 years, so I imagine it’ll be OK on that front, given I’m switching only due to issues with the USB port and power button.
YMMV but for regular users it should be fine.
Not sure how the CPU compares, but I’m still running a Pixel 2 XL and the only real issue I have is the lack of RAM. CPU speed is no issue here.
