Man, in this very thread the progression I’m bitching about happens with “There aren’t any tankies!” comments.
“Leaves of three, leave it be” isn’t a law, but it’s quick advice. If you’re out in the woods of Appalachia and see some ivy with three leaves, chances are it’s Poison Ivy. “Generally posters claiming there aren’t many tankies on the Fediverse are concern trolls” isn’t a law, but it’s quick advice. If, in the Fediverse, of all places, someone is not merely claiming to have personally not seen many tankies, but firmly saying (or implying through additional statements) that there aren’t many tankies on here, they are generally a concern troll.
As for tankie apologists, I don’t see why a tankie apologist should be regarded differently from a Nazi apologist, or any other fascist apologist. Ardent apologism by people not part of the in-group is a thing, and surprisingly common. Like atheists who praise Christians to high heaven (pun intended), or right-wing minorities playing “They’re not that bad” games about the alt-right.
I don’t understand people who comfortably deal in their own generalizations or absolutes. They’re comforting because they’re simple but they’re rarely correct because they’re colored by the random chance of your personal experience and your innate biases. This is why science education is so important: it teaches you that whichever observations you non-systemically generate are probably at least somewhat bullshit. They might make sense on a personal basis until you challenge the assumptions they’re based on.
Your experience is entirely different than mine. I’m very active on Lemmy and I rarely see tankies as defined. Guess I’m a concern troll! Or am I a tankie apologist? I also see you calling others that don’t meet your criteria concern trolls or tankie apologists. I guess we’re all concern trolls, apologists, or whatever else you want to say we are so you can write off whole cloth anyone that disagrees with you. On the bright side, you proudly proclaim your biases and assumptions are facts, so it’s easy enough to know it’s probably best just to block you.
“You just want to write off anyone who disagrees with you!”
lmao
Sorry for not having a scientific study of Lemmy’s population ready to satisfy you. It’s funny - any time I bring receipts, regardless of how many or how upvoted, it’s always the same story - “It’s just a few bad apples! There’s not a lot of them! They don’t bother you!”
If you make a claim about tankies but never back but beyond the claim of personal experinece, then you at least owe it to yourself to understand that you may be wrong.
Alright, what exactly kind of evidence do you think is possible to gather in this situation? Realistically speaking? Am I to ignore my eyes and (metaphorical) ears because they aren’t a scientific study?
Rigorous studies trump anecdotal evidence, but anecdotal evidence trumps a complete absence of evidence.
A collection of posts, perhaps already deleted and in the mod log? Any users you have personally seen and reported simping for China that the mods continue to have around anyway? Mod policies publicly making this okay? A meme page in love with toltalitarianism?
It doesn’t have to be a scientific study… just any kind of evidence other than “trust me bro”.
Don’t ignore your eyes, but also don’t be so damn pretentious. Show us what you are seeing.
Don’t ignore your eyes, but also don’t be so damn pretentious. Show us what you are seeing.
If I got through the trouble of digging them up for the nth time, what will it take for you to admit that I have a point? Give me a rough number of examples and what criteria you need to accept them as legitimate. I’ve crawled through this shite too many times only for commenters to backpedal and say “Well, that’s not upvoted enough/not in the right community/not enough examples” to go through it blind again.
You’re generally honest in your arguments, at least insofar as we’ve interacted, but I really fucking despise wasting my time. So I do have to insist on you giving your criteria to accept the examples.
Give me a rough number and criteria, and I will gladly hop over and drag out whichever you want, the ‘Sinophobia’ bans and/or the assorted tankie bullshite.
If you have dug them up N times, just paste them here? No? Just a whole dump of everything you got or an old comment would do.
Your reply implies I would readily dismiss the evidence… is there any reason you believe that?
You are wasting everyone else’s time by making claims you can’t back up. I am saying this as someone who hates any authoritarian regime and will do anything to avoid it becoming a reality. We both hate tankies.
Seems like lots of people in the comment section are also talking about what their eyes are seeing and it contradicts your claim. So whose eyes shall we trust?
From my limited and personal experience of the .ml instance, I don’t see any of this happening, just lots of tankie-boogyman rhetoric. But my observations are not enough to make a conclusion. And neither are yours. That’s why we need to back it up with evidence. Do you have any indication of any communities on .ml where the mods let this happen openly? If so, please link it.
If you have dug them up N times, just paste them here? No?
Yeah, if I had a better search option for my ~7000 comment long comment history, that might be viable.
Your reply implies I would readily dismiss the evidence… is there any reason you believe that?
Yes. Because people are generally stubborn and reluctant to admit that they’re wrong, or that their skepticism is wrong. And because I’ve done this song and dance numerous times before in which the person I was responded with 'No TRUE Scotsman’d their way into rejecting everything I gave them and demanding another dozen fucking examples.
Seems like lots of people in the comment section are also talking about what their eyes are seeing and it contradicts your claim. So whose eyes shall we trust?
Lots of people in this comment section are talking about the exact same thing - several people are discussing their personal experiences being banned or banned pre-emptively for going against tankie rhetoric. Are we reading the same fucking comment section?
From my limited and personal experience of the .ml instance, I don’t see any of this happening, just lots of tankie-boogyman rhetoric. But my observations are not enough to make a conclusion. And neither are yours. That’s why we need to back it up with evidence. Do you have any indication of any communities on .ml where the mods let this happen openly? If so, please link it.
Man, in this very thread the progression I’m bitching about happens with “There aren’t any tankies!” comments.
“Leaves of three, leave it be” isn’t a law, but it’s quick advice. If you’re out in the woods of Appalachia and see some ivy with three leaves, chances are it’s Poison Ivy. “Generally posters claiming there aren’t many tankies on the Fediverse are concern trolls” isn’t a law, but it’s quick advice. If, in the Fediverse, of all places, someone is not merely claiming to have personally not seen many tankies, but firmly saying (or implying through additional statements) that there aren’t many tankies on here, they are generally a concern troll.
As for tankie apologists, I don’t see why a tankie apologist should be regarded differently from a Nazi apologist, or any other fascist apologist. Ardent apologism by people not part of the in-group is a thing, and surprisingly common. Like atheists who praise Christians to high heaven (pun intended), or right-wing minorities playing “They’re not that bad” games about the alt-right.
I don’t understand people who comfortably deal in their own generalizations or absolutes. They’re comforting because they’re simple but they’re rarely correct because they’re colored by the random chance of your personal experience and your innate biases. This is why science education is so important: it teaches you that whichever observations you non-systemically generate are probably at least somewhat bullshit. They might make sense on a personal basis until you challenge the assumptions they’re based on.
Your experience is entirely different than mine. I’m very active on Lemmy and I rarely see tankies as defined. Guess I’m a concern troll! Or am I a tankie apologist? I also see you calling others that don’t meet your criteria concern trolls or tankie apologists. I guess we’re all concern trolls, apologists, or whatever else you want to say we are so you can write off whole cloth anyone that disagrees with you. On the bright side, you proudly proclaim your biases and assumptions are facts, so it’s easy enough to know it’s probably best just to block you.
“You just want to write off anyone who disagrees with you!”
lmao
Sorry for not having a scientific study of Lemmy’s population ready to satisfy you. It’s funny - any time I bring receipts, regardless of how many or how upvoted, it’s always the same story - “It’s just a few bad apples! There’s not a lot of them! They don’t bother you!”
If you make a claim about tankies but never back but beyond the claim of personal experinece, then you at least owe it to yourself to understand that you may be wrong.
Alright, what exactly kind of evidence do you think is possible to gather in this situation? Realistically speaking? Am I to ignore my eyes and (metaphorical) ears because they aren’t a scientific study?
Rigorous studies trump anecdotal evidence, but anecdotal evidence trumps a complete absence of evidence.
A collection of posts, perhaps already deleted and in the mod log? Any users you have personally seen and reported simping for China that the mods continue to have around anyway? Mod policies publicly making this okay? A meme page in love with toltalitarianism?
It doesn’t have to be a scientific study… just any kind of evidence other than “trust me bro”.
Don’t ignore your eyes, but also don’t be so damn pretentious. Show us what you are seeing.
If I got through the trouble of digging them up for the nth time, what will it take for you to admit that I have a point? Give me a rough number of examples and what criteria you need to accept them as legitimate. I’ve crawled through this shite too many times only for commenters to backpedal and say “Well, that’s not upvoted enough/not in the right community/not enough examples” to go through it blind again.
You’re generally honest in your arguments, at least insofar as we’ve interacted, but I really fucking despise wasting my time. So I do have to insist on you giving your criteria to accept the examples.
Give me a rough number and criteria, and I will gladly hop over and drag out whichever you want, the ‘Sinophobia’ bans and/or the assorted tankie bullshite.
Before I give any criteria, let’s discuss this:
If you have dug them up N times, just paste them here? No? Just a whole dump of everything you got or an old comment would do.
Your reply implies I would readily dismiss the evidence… is there any reason you believe that?
You are wasting everyone else’s time by making claims you can’t back up. I am saying this as someone who hates any authoritarian regime and will do anything to avoid it becoming a reality. We both hate tankies.
Seems like lots of people in the comment section are also talking about what their eyes are seeing and it contradicts your claim. So whose eyes shall we trust?
From my limited and personal experience of the .ml instance, I don’t see any of this happening, just lots of tankie-boogyman rhetoric. But my observations are not enough to make a conclusion. And neither are yours. That’s why we need to back it up with evidence. Do you have any indication of any communities on .ml where the mods let this happen openly? If so, please link it.
Yeah, if I had a better search option for my ~7000 comment long comment history, that might be viable.
Yes. Because people are generally stubborn and reluctant to admit that they’re wrong, or that their skepticism is wrong. And because I’ve done this song and dance numerous times before in which the person I was responded with 'No TRUE Scotsman’d their way into rejecting everything I gave them and demanding another dozen fucking examples.
Lots of people in this comment section are talking about the exact same thing - several people are discussing their personal experiences being banned or banned pre-emptively for going against tankie rhetoric. Are we reading the same fucking comment section?
https://ibb.co/zsbr6MW
https://ibb.co/TTbQDmb
https://ibb.co/JHM8357
https://ibb.co/CWkzC31
https://ibb.co/zsbr6MW